"Visits to theatres, motion pictures or other cultural entertainment are strictly prohibited for farm workers of Polish nationality."
And under No. 12there is a vital provision which says that workers of Polish nationality may be physically punished. with this document and the views expressed there. of March, 1941, that is, it is more than a year before I assumed office. Such a nonsensical and impossible decree was never made known to me during my term of office. should like to refer to the decrees which I issued independently of the past, the fact that prior decrees were superseded and no longer valid. Regardless of such nonsensical decrees and directives, no matter which agency in the Reich issued them, my decrees were published in this manuals. Because of the time factor and because of my respect for the Tribunal, I shall not ask that the Tribunal look at all of them, but I should ask thatI be permitted to quote just one sentence from the manifest which has already been referred to, in order to refute the nonsense. The manifest says that just and fair treatment be accorded to these workers and that the directives and their supplements be issued at least every three months to the people in charge of enterprises. The people in charge were reminded of these decrees and that adherence to these decrees and directives was to be kept in mind all the time.
Q Does the manifest close therewith? humane treatment of these workers, that they were to have food and free time and so forth.
Q You issued many, many decrees and directives. Was there any resistance towards your basic directives, and if so, what did you do thereupon? emphasized my decrees and referred to them, for these decrees had been approved by the Fuehrer and were to apply to my sphere of influence.
Q As far as care and welfare were concerned, did the DAF play a part?
And what was the task of the Deutsche Arbeits Front? after their interest, as such; as a matter of course, it had to concern itself with the welfare of foreign workers as well. That was its natural task, to work along the lines of and to be a corrective measure when it came to administrative positions, a function carried out in other countries by unions.
Q What task did the entrepreneurs have? concerned, of regulating the total production, and of course, they were responsible for their workers and the foreign workers which had been assigned to them. Front responsible?
Q Now, the workers mostly were housed in camps. Who guided the installations of these camps? analysis, was under the Deutsche Gewerbeaufsicht (German Trade Supervision), and that was under the German Labor Ministry. Gewerbeaufsicht had to survey the measures of compulsion used by entrepreneurs and people who did not comply with the regulations and used compulsion.
Q Did you yourself take measures to dispose of conditions in the camps? the German Labor Ministry, which was the competent authority.
Q What were the living conditions within the camps? Who was responsible there? This person, in agreement with the D.A.F. and the works manager, was put in service, and to my knowledge -- this was not my sphere of influence -- this man had to be confirmed and certified to by the Security Division.
Q You are talking about the Sicherheitsbehoerde. That is, the security authorities. To what extent was the police active in the surveillance of these camps and the keeping of discipline ? Commandant, and it did not have any connection with the police. In my opinion, as is true in every State, the police had surveillance and control rights, and the nature of the industry was to be kept secret. Beyond that, the police had no function.
Q Were these camps shut off from the outside world? How were things like that when you assumed office? off form the world, and they were surrounded with barbed wire. To me, this idea was incompatible with producing work, and I worked with much energy against this shutting off, and I brought this about, so that there was no barbed wire used, and other measures which were to limit the Eastern workers I tried to do away with, so that the picture which was presented yesterday actually was realized. I wanted a willingness to work and I considered that anything other than what I wanted would be incompatible with the work problem.
these foreign workers? applied to the feeding of the German people, and the people who had to work hardest received additional food.
Q Did this actually apply and obtain when you assumed office? in addition to the foreign workers who were already in the Reich, I was to bring in another quota of foreign workers, the first step which I took was to visit the Reich Nutrition Minister, for to me it was a matter of course that bringing in of foreign workrs would, first of all, entail a feeding problem, and that this was the first problem, for poorly fed workers, even if they want to, cannot turn out satisfactory work. In many, many conversations, and referring to the Reichsmarshal and the Fuehrer, I brought about the feeding schedule that was put down in laws. It was not easy to do this, for feeding in Germany was always a difficult problem, but without these laws it would not have been possible for me to carry through my task. tell us about terrible abuses. Did not anything like that come to your attention, or did you not yourself have any knowledge of this? the work camps are concerned, I never had any catastrophic reports about anything like that as far as civilian workers were concerned. I again tried to have this matter controlled constantly and checked constantly. The works managers themselves were very serious about the matter of provisions. and rather criticize conditions which obtained? appointed Plenipotentiaries for Labor in their Gaus, I called their attention to the food problem and obligated them to give complete attention to the matter of food and billetting. I had work from two gaus that my directives had notbeen taken seriously enough. In one case I immediately travelled to Essen personally and remedied the situation there. One was the matter of the barbed wire.
In the other case in Bavarian Ostmark I also intervened personally. of the gaus and German provinces and states and again stressed the importance of their adhering to these decrees.
DR. SERVATIUS: I am referring to Document 19, which is found in English Book I, page 54, Document Sauckel 19.
THE PRESIDENT: 19?
DR. SERVATIUS: In my document book, Number 19 in the first document book, page 54. Only a portion of this is in print. This is a copy of a decree and letter to the Gauleiter Offices and Gauleiters. It says the following:
"If in a Gau district the statement was recently made: Should any one in the Gau have to freeze next winter, the first ones to freeze should be the Russians (that is the Russian civilian laborers mobilized for work in the Gau), such an utterance shows plainly that in that region of the Gau the contact between the administrative office of labor mobilization and the competent political offices is as yet not close enough; for it is one of the most important tasks in the mobilization of labor and in the collaboration between you and the Gauleiters as my deputies for the mobilization of labor, to see to it that the foreign labor recruited for work in the German armament industry and food economy be looked after in such manner as to enable them to give the maximum in efficiency. It would therefore be entirely wrong to think of protection against want only for German fellow countrymen, and to be satisfied unhesitatingly with inadequate provisions for laborers of foreign origin. On the contrary, the need is to be aware constantly of the fact that in order to bring about victory, a maximum of efficiency must be demanded not only of the German fellow countrymen but also of the foreign workers, and that it would be absurd first to go to the expense which is considerable for German economy of hauling foreign labor into the country, to arrange for work and then to fall in their proper care, with a resultant decline in their efficiency or possibly even their ruin." BY DR. SERVATIUS:
Q How about the clothing of foreign workers?
relatively little trouble, for these workers had comparatively good clothing, but the clothing of the Eastern workers was a problem. On behalf of the Eastern workers, I applied for a quota of clothing for them, applying to two and a half million workers, that they receive a complete change of under and outer clothing. For that, 10,000 workers were required to supply this quota of clothing, as well as 30,000 tons of raw materials. Therefore, all possible concern was taken for the clothing, and this clothing actually was issued.
DR. SERVATIUS: The French Delegation submitted the document RF No.5. This is a recruiting statement "Foreigners work in Germany." I submitted this, and the High Tribunal again took official notice of this document. I should like to submit it again and refer to three pictures contained therein. The essential thing about these pictures is that the workers coming from the East, many of them, arrived barefoot, and later we see pictures where these female workers are seen well dressed, working in Germany , where it can be seen that their clothing problems had been alleviated.
THE PRESIDENT: Is this Sauckel 5?
DR. SERVATIUS: It is the French Delegation, your Honor, RF No 5. BY DR. SERVATIUS:
Q How about the time of work? Who regulated the working hours? Fuehrer Decrees, and later on, by Reich Minister Dr. Goebbels. The carrying through of these decrees was my sphere.
Q What was the average time of work? working time. There was the legal working time of eighrt hours. Anything beyond eight hours had to be considered as overtime and paid a s such. down for 54 hours. Then, when Reich Minister Dr. Goebbels became Reich Plenipotentiary for the entire war effort, against my objections and against the objec tions of other offices but on the basis of the authority which he had, he proclaimed a 10-hour work day for all businesses. He demanded the 10-hour day and proclaimed it. However, this could not be carried through, for in many industries and offices work had to be regulated according to the difficulties which appeared at that time, that is, the problem of raw materials, the problem of power, fuel, and so fourth. demanded it 11 and 12 hours of work applied. German workers, as well, worked longer hours, and of course they were compensated correspondingly. the following is set down.
"From the reports of displaced workers who had returned home, it can be seen that the average capacity par week was at least 72 hours," to be important of this time.
"Sixty-four hour weeks were not infrequent. Cases of 100-hour weeks in installments of 30 to 38 hours duration were mentioned."
What can you tell us about this? Did you know of cases like that?
concerned with people who were being used in concentration camps or whether the were used in another sector as civilian workers, the sector which was my responsibility. of time in which long hours of work applied, and that was determined by the in. dustry, and the German workers were obligated to work. But if this applied, a corresponding rest period had to be interspersed. not determine from the document and I cannot give you any information.
Q How about free time?
Q And who regulated free time?
Q How about the use of children and young people? permitted to work. As to children under 14, just a few may be used in agriculture, a few hours a day.
Q Did you issue decrees about working hours for children? tance when they applied. ten by the Reich minister Rosenberg addressed to Dr. Lammers, dated the 20th of July 1944.
THE PRESIDENT: Has this been put in before? Has this been offered in evidence before?
DR. SERVATIUS: This document was submitted several days ago in cross examination. I myself have just received it now. BY DR. SERVATIUS: cruitment of young people. Referring to the age group 15 to 20, they were to be used in the Reich during the time of war. Then the document refers to the taking of young people in the age group of 10 to 14 into the Reich, and that is the "H*** Action". It says also that the objective of this action is the better care of these youthful workers of the HJ, and the use of apprentices in German economy, and that these measures have already been taken in agreement with the GBA, that is, with you.
Some of these suggestions are to be put in now. Please comment on them and tell us whether you were responsible for the use of these young people. addresses, my name is nut mentioned.
Q Therefore, there were no special directives?
A No. This was an incident with which I did not concern myself. mentioned in connection with the Schirach case and submitted by the Prosecution. It is document 1137-PS, a letter dated 19/10/44/
On page 3 of this document, the following is set down:
"The following workers have been supplied to Germany: First of all, 3,500 young men and 500 girls for the Junkers works; second, 2,000 young men and 700 girls to the Todt Organization, from the Occupied Eastern Regions. Therefore, through the offices which are under the Hitler youth, 5,500 boys and 1,200 girls were put at the disposal of the armament industry." with you at all?
Q. How were these people brought into the armament industry? people for whom work was prohibited. I was under the impression that this was an order, but I had nothing to do with it and my office had no concern with it.
Q How about the use of women, that is, foreign women, for labor purposes? used.
Q I have a document 025-PS which has been submitted. This is US Exhibit 698, which has been submitted very recently, and which is not contained in the document books. occasion you dealt with the use of foreign female labor, In the third paragraph it says;
"In this way, the Fuehrer has sanctioned the use of 400 to 500 thousand female workers in the eastern regions for domestic purposes, and GBA" -- that is you --"has been charged with the carrying through of this action which is to be concluded in approximately three months."
It says further:
"It is in accord with the specific wish of the Fuehrer that as many women as possible shall be Germanized."
A Yes; here we are concerned with the decree from the Fuehrer for German domestic life, especially in order to alleviate conditions applied to German peasant women. Four hundred to five hundred thousand female workers were to be brought into the Reich from the Eastern Region. I should like to mention, in referring to the minutes, that I did not set down these minutes, neither did my office, but most likely that these minutes were set down on the basis of notes which rather some gentleman took -- four hundred to five hundred thousand female workers to be used in the home ---I should like to remark that they were to be brought into the Reich only on a voluntary basis; in fact, only perhaps thirteen to fifteen thousand---I believe the figure was---came into the Reich. The concept to Germanize, this concept as used here, refers only to the volunteer desire on the part of these people to perhaps later on remain in Germany voluntarily. received? Some things have been mentioned here and it has been said that "if the worker can no longer work, he is no longer a concern of ours;" that that supposedly is the basic principle of yours; that it is further stated that "work, food, and pay has to be determined if the worker can he longer work---then he is just something that we no longer are concerned with." What can you say in regard to these accusations? and where this is.
Q This is laid down in the record; that is, the minutes of the session; I have the page, the German, 2789. It says there "If the worker can no longer work, he is no longer any concern of ours." Did you represent this principle?
A On the contrary; there are hundreds of precise and clear decrees given out by me. These decrees are written down in the Reichsgesetzblatt. They are also present in special issues sent to the employment agencies and all of my statements are set down exact ly, that the foreign workers were brought into the Reich---as far as their treatment is concerned, when they were sick, this treatment was accorded them in line with German laws and of course there was insurance as well.
THE PRESIDENT: Dr. Servatius, were you putting to the defendant a document where it was alleged he had said that after they were unfit to work, that it is no more his concern? Was it the document you were putting to him?
DR. SERVATIUS: This document was submitted regarding the female workers about whom he is alleged to have said that they were to be Germanized. I have loft that document, your Honor, and now I have turned to the question of medical attention.
THE PRESIDENT: You mean that was in 025-PS, US 698.
DR. SERVATIUS: This document 025 refers to female workers only but we have left that question. We have disposed of that. I turned to another question, that of medical welfare but I am no longer dealing with the question of female workers. BY DR. SERVATIUS: as far as the state of health was concerned, that there was not enough medical care for the foreign workers?
A No. Not only German physicians became or got to be company physicians in those industries, and they had to deal with the hygienic conditions of health for the workers there, but also from the home countries of the foreign workers numerous positions and medical auziliary personnel was hired and put to use in these camps. and what other agencies of control operated?
DR. SERVATIUS: Just a moment. I should like to refer to document No. 2. In this document, I have put down these control agencies and agencies of inspections. They are put down in a comprehensive picture, diagrams. It is document No. 2. I should like to explain this diagram briefly. In the center, you have the Reich plan or ministry under Seldte. Underneath that, the surveillance during peace and the industry and construction police.
That is the only agency Which had police powers of compulsion; that is, against the resistance, which could do away with a business and beyond that, there were other places which had to deal with the difficult problem of the care of these workers. First of all, if you turn to the Reich, the German Labor Front is shown. That is a comprehensive agency of the interests of the workers and of thepeople giving work and in one way, it represents those functions which in the past were carried out by the unions. From there on, the care turned to the industrial involved. There was a special inspection office of the Reich, inspection office of the German Labor Front, and this is a place where the foreign workers had their own liaison men in order to take complaints. In the enterprises themselves, foreign workers were found who could report on condition there. Then, turning further to the right, is the Reich Food Ministry which as well, through the state office, concerned itself with food and billets, and the report which went to the Reich Foreign Minister in a diplomatic channel, and then with Sauckel in the last instance; and then for the Eastern workers, there is a special agency under the Ministry Rosenberg and that is the Central Board for the peoples from the East. And this last document, which we saw, apparently came from one of the gentlemen of this office; this Central Board for the people from theEast had their agents in the industries and received their reports. All these reports then turned to Sauckel.
Now, I shall turn to theleft part of my picture. Sauckel himself instituted for inspectional purposes, first of all, a labor staff which was sent about to visit enterprises and we have heard through several witnesses that these inspectors appeared and saw that everything was in order. Then he had a special office, the Reich Inspectorate. Complaints were sent to this inspectorate, complaints which came from the German Labor Front, and Sauckel says that he immediately transmitted these complaints to the proper agencies -- they were sent to the Reich Inspectorate which in turn advised the necessary offices and in the final analysis, for the carrying had to use the compulsory measures as applied by the Reich Labor Ministry. Then, also, the Gauleiters were put to use to serve for the surveillance and for the witnesses which had appeared here, witnesses who had been Gauleiters, had confirmed that, as they were charged with these problems and that they acted in accordance.
To the left, we deal with care, through the Reich Ministry for Public Enlightenment and Propaganda which carried out a surveillance of the camps and of the workers. Then, in conclusion, the very last point; the Wehrmacht had its own surveillance machinery through their inspectors which took care of the prisoners of war and which saw to it that the Geneva Convention was adhered. All of this was marshaled in the person of Sauckel and he has just told us that no catastrophic abuses were reported to him and that he used decrees and gave hisdirections and directives that way.
THE PRESIDENT: Dr. Servatius, will you ask the defendant whether that was a correct statement on the meaning of the chart? BY DR. SERVATIUS: submitted to you, is that correct? they were authorized and did you supervise the Gauleiters? discipline was concerned, they were not subordinate to me but through my labor staff, through the members of the staff at intervals of about three months, I had these Gaus visited and on the occasion of these visits, the complaints of the Gauleiters were listened to and enterprises and camps were inspected and it was checked to see how far my directives were carried out or not; and I should like to remark that this control or this check did not visit concentration camps, for that was an entirely different pattern which was subordinate to Pohl and I had no right to interfere there
THE PRESIDENT: We will adjourn now.
(A recess was taken until 1400 hours) (The hearing reconvened at 1400 hours, 29 May 1946)
DR. KUBUSCHOK (Counsel for defendant von Papen): I ask permission for the defendant von Papen to be absent from the court sessions tomorrow morning and afternoon, as I need a longer conversation with him for the preparation of his defense, which I would otherwise not be able to bring about. Dr. Flexner will be present during the session.
THE PRESIDENT: Yes.
THE MARSHAL: If it please the Tribunal, a report is made that the defendant Goering is absent.
THE PRESIDENT: As I said this morning, the Tribunal will rise at 4 this afternoon. BY DR. SERVATIUS: to one question. workers. Did that also apply to the prisoners of war and inmates of concentration camps?
A No. As far as the prisoner of war camps were concerned, the authority these prisoners of war were kept. even if they worked, only the Concentration camps themselves were responsible for them; that is, the administration. Reich Ministry of Labor. What were the tasks of that inspection department? before, in the Ministry of Labor because I wanted to see, in the entire area of the Reich and in the occupied territories where German enterprise and German labor contracts were valid, that the unity of these contracts and their execution should be examined, that unified administrative regulations should be examined and brought about, and also to see whether my decrees were carried out concerning food and lodging, and to what extent it was necessary to change them.
That also came out and was put down in a decree which I made concerning that inspection deparment. with regard to the German labor Front? That was the central inspection office for the care of foreign workers. camps in Germany, to care for the foreign workers, or rather, to inspect and examine the care that was taken of foreign workers, and to see whether that was done as it should be. ion department report that to you, or who received the report? Front, Dr. Ley, and myself, which was also added as an annex to the decree about the institution of a central inspection department. It stated that in every case where conditions in camps were in question or referred to, the central inspection department had to go directly to the Reich offices, that is, the inspection office in the Reich labor Ministry. However, shortcomings in the use of labor or of manpower itself-- for instance, whether too much or too little manpower was available--were to be reported to me.
Q By this agreement, therefore, your rights were limited?
DR. SERVATIUS: That is document 1913-PS, which has been submitted. It is an agreement between Sauckel and Dr. Ley of the 20th of September, 1943; it is USA 227.
It is document number 41 in the English document book. I shall only refer to it, without quoting from it.
Q What other kinds of inspection offices existed then? And I am thinking about the Frenchman. whose members in connection with the German labor front, had the right to visit camps, to listen to the workers individually, and to accept complaints from them. A special agreement had been reached with the French Govenment, in collaboration with the Reich foreign Ministry.
DR. SERVATIUS: That is document Sauckel No. 31. It is at page 79 of the English text in document book No.1. "French Agency for the care of the French workers utilized in the Reich." That is a circular from the General Plenipotentiary for Labor Commitment dated 30 April 1942. I submit herewith the document itself, which is in this collection. I quote:
"Herewith I publish the following communication of the Foreign Ministry of 10 April 1942.
"The Government of the Reich has notified the French Government that it agrees to the following regulations regarding the care of the French voluntary workers in Germany:
"Besides the already existing office for prisoners of war, an agency for the French civilian workers will be established under the direction of Ambassador Scapini in Berlin. The Reich Government is making a building to house this agency. The office may establish branches in four other German cities.
"The agency is charged with the care of the French workers in Germany. It supervises the observation of the contracts concluded by the engaged workers. It may accept propositions from the workers and transmit them to competent offices, and may see to the removal of unwholesome conditions. It is entitled to issue certificates and documents for the use of the workers before the French authorities."
"Moreover, the Chief of the entire French representation is granted the diplomatic privileges of personal immunity in execution of their tasks, as well as exemption from German juridiction and from the compulsory power of the police." BY DR. SERVATIUS:
Q Practically, how did that office work with you?
and with me, the representative of that office, took part in the negotiations in France with the French government. The office changed, insofar as the care of the civilian workers was later taken over by MR. Bruenedon in the place of Mr. Scapini.
Q Only a change of personnel?
A Yes, only a change of personnel. I have frequently talked with these gentlemen and acted according to their demands. East? office of the Reich Commissar for the Eastern territories.
Q How did that office work? only that it was a German organization but it had the confidence of the eastern workers which worked with us as liaison men.
Q Didn't you receive any complaints from that side? and which were reported to me through him, none. discipline, What regulations existed there in order to maintain labor discipline, punctuality, correctness of work? What kind of regulations existed? were a matter of the individual industries. Each industry, each unit, had regulations which, in agreement between management and the workers' council, had been established in normal times. This council had the authority to establish fines in the form of payments. During the war the question of labor discipline had become more central because it was not possible, on the basis of scarcity of workers, to make use of the right of dismissal because the German worker and German labor were under emergency decrees, war time emergency decrees and laws. In order to maintain it, though, later, upon suggestion by the Ministerial Council, I issued a decree No. 13.
That decree is available, and provides, first, a graduated punishment within the industries against perpetration against work discipline; that is lack of punctuality.
DR. SERVATIUS: That is Document No. 23, Document Book Sauckel; in the English book, No. I, Page 62. The witness has mentioned the contents. I only refer to it now.
THE WITNESS: These measures within the industries for the maintenance of work discipline were graduated from a reproach for laxity up to fines, military fines as high as a day's wages. BY DR. SERVATIUS:
Q What was done in case of tenacious perpetrations? taken care of by the Honor Courts of the Labor Front, it had to be reported to the police. that decree? Germans.
Q And what in case of criminal offenses?
A They also had to be reported to the police. The labor authorities had no competence in criminal and similar cases. were not applied correctly? That is if instead of fines corporal punishment would have been used?
A These complaints came to the Labor Front; that is to say, to the Liaison member of the Labor Front.
Q Have any such cases been reported to you? within our competence.
Q What were the labor training camps, educational camps?
Q Who came into such camps? cers as punishment for perpetrations against labor regulations.
Q Was that the same as concentration camps?
A No, in my opinion not. Also, the labor training camps, correction camps, were neither under the care of the Reich Labor Ministry nor under nine. That was a police institution. a number of workers, in fact, came into concentration camps. How can you explain that?
A DR. SERVATIUS: That is Document 1063, USA Exhibit No. 219, a letter of 17 December, '42; in the English Document Book No. 28, in the Slave Labor book. BY DR. SERVATIUS: and the Security Service, SD, secret to all SS officers; at any rate, not to you. I quote: "For reasons of war necessity not to be discussed further here, the Reichfuehrer SS and Chief of the German Police, on 14 December, 1942, has ordered that until the end of January, 1943, at least 35,000 prisoners qualified for work are to be sent to the concentration camps. In order to reach this number, the following measures are required: 1. As of now, so far, until 1 February 1943, all eastern workers, or such foreign workers who have been fugitives or have broken contracts, are to be brought by the quickest means to the nearest concentration camps --"
THE PRESIDENT: Presumably, the witness knows the document.
DR. SERVATIUS: Yes. I only want to inform him briefly. BY DR. SERVATIUS:
Q Do you know that document?
Q You didn't look through it yet? sive part. Will you please read at the bottom of the first page. It says the following: "To Other Officers: Every one of these measures has to be described as absolutely necessary measures of security with causes given and taken from the individual case so that complaints can be prevented and complaints avoided."