Where did you come from? Are you married? Do you have any children?" etc. etc. I cannot recall one single case where one of those inmates who spoke a different language told me, "I am in this camp here without any reason." The answers which I received when I asked those questions were approximately, "I was a member of a terroristic group. I was a member of the resistance movement. I participated in an attempt at somebody's life with a bomb," and similar statements
Q Now, Herr Mummenthey, you will have to admit though that already since 1942 or 1943 possibly, numerous workers came from the occupied territories which had been occupied by Germany and were being sent to Germany. You will know that, won't you, Witness?
A Of course I did hear about it.
Q Where were these workers sent to? Do you know anything about it or don't you?
A I couldn't tell you for certain. I could only tell you what I read in the papers, or what I heard from individual firms with whom I had to work. These workers were sent to the individual firms under compulsion by the labor office, and they were either working in their small plants or in the plants themselves. For instance, you have the eastern workers who were wearing the insignia "East".
Q Could those workers who at the time were coming into Germany 100,000 at a time, could they move about freely in Germany?
AAs far as I could see, yes, because you could see them in the streets.
Q These foreigners, in 1942 or 1943 did they become more of a plague in Germany, where you could hear more foreign languages spoken in Germany than German in the streets? I mean in the restaurants, etc.
AAt the time we used the term of "the muddle of voices of Babylon". There were factories, for instance, the factory of the Messersmitt Works, where the whole plant was full of foreign workers.
Q And how can you explain the fact now, and I am talking now about '42 and '43 where you did have knowledge about it, where all of a Court No. II, Case No. 4.sudden certain groups out of these foreigners were committed to concentration camps.
Did you at the time have any misgivings about it? You understand my question, don't you, Witness? The foreign workers were working in the labor camps, and they were working outside of the labor camps in the plants, and all of a sudden on a beautiful morning the Belgian whose name was "XX" was transferred to a concentration camp. Why?
A I heard on one occasion that the Gestapo, the Secret State Police, was sending foreign workers who had left their working place repeatedly to a concentration camp, or rather they were not sent to concentration camps but to labor re-education camps for a period of at the utmost eight weeks. Then they again returned to the plant. Now many out of these workers who came from abroad under the framework of Sauckel's Action, how many of these people were sent to concentration camps, I don't know.
Q Herr Mummenthey, you are from Saxonia, aren't you, and you come from Aue, which is your place of birth, Aue, A-u-e. Is it correct that in the last few weeks you could receive reports through the papers that the Soviet Union was taking German citizens and interning them in camps and then transferring them to Russia based on a working contract? Do you know anything about it, that they were doing that under compulsion?
A I heard that too, but I know from both the papers and from my wife who wrote through my father-in-law that there was a compulsory labor camp at Rue where they were exploiting the uranium minerals, which was then being sent to Russia.
Q In order to make the atomic bomb?
A I don't know what they were doing it for, but it is to be assumed. The workers under this action are under compulsion to work, and that by their labor offices, and this is done by a control, or by virtue of a Control Council regulation. This Control Council regulation states that they are being used for reconstruction work.
Court No. II, Case No. 4.
Q And therefore this is exactly the same as was being done in Germany originally when they were taking the workers from Belgium, Norway, Holland, etc., etc., by saying that they were coming to Germany by virtue of a working contract?
AApproximately, yes.
Q And then all of a sudden something happens which moves the Gestapo, or whatever you want to call the organization, to pick one of the workers out of the group because he didn't want to work or because he did sabotage, and then commit him to police custody and possibly later on transfer him to a concentration camp, is that correct?
A The commitment into a concentration camp by the Gestapo must have happened by virtue of something that happened. I can't explain it in any other way. There must have been some sort of an incident which was to be found either in the criminal field or possibly due to security reasons of a larger extent. Perhaps the person participated in terroristic measures.
DR. FROESCHMANN: I believe I have created the basis now in order to eliminate the misunderstanding with reference to any questions.
THE PRESIDENT: The only misunderstanding now, Dr. Froeschmann, is in your own mind.
DR. FROESCHMANN: Namely, your Honor?
THE PRESIDENT: Namely that the women and the children who were in Ravensbrueck were not there because they had committed any offense, and the trainloads of Jews from the east who never saw a labor camp but were shipped directly to a concentration camp and then sorted out, and the weak ones killed and the strong ones kept. That wasn't a labor camp, and that had nothing whatever to do with breaking regulations in a labor camp. Don't mislead yourself, Dr. Froeschmann. You are too smart a man.
DR. FROESCHMANN: Your Honor, I am only dealing with the case of Defendant Mummenthey.
THE PRESIDENT: Good.
Court No. II, Case No. 4.
DR. FROESCHMANN: The DEST neither employed women or children. That is absolutely far from me, your Honor.
THE PRESIDENT: That is right.
DR. FROESCHMANN: And if you didn't know me you would possibly doubt it, but you know me. It is absolutely far from me to excuse any such crimes as described by your Honor at the present moment. To try to excuse such crimes I am far from that, but-
THE PRESIDENT: I am very willing to believe that, Dr. Froeschmann. I do believe it.
DR. FROESCHMANN: Thank you, your Honor.
Q (By Dr. Froeschmann) Herr Mummenthey, I will now leave this chapter, and I shall turn to the last chapter which we are going to discuss now by discussing a question which was brought up by the Tribunal yesterday and touched upon by the Tribunal. That is the supervisory duty or duty of supervision which you had as the man in charge of the DEST. I would like to ask you, witness, on the occasion of your visits in the individual plants, did you ever convince yourself of the fact that the plant was working in an orderly manner and that there were no bad conditions in there, and I mean that from a human point of view?
A I visited the plants as often as I could, and on that occasion I visited the entire plant when I had enough time at my disposal. I believe that I did more in that respect than I could possibly do. I would like to point out that in order to visit the individual plants at regular intervals I could only travel at night. In 1943 and 1944 I actually spent one-third of the year on the train at night. There were 120 train trips, 60 official trips, approximately 60 visits of plants, therefore, or then we visited firms, enterprises with which we had to do. I couldn't possibly do it in any other way. In between we had the visits of collaborators, for instance, of my colleagues, Schondorf and Schwarz, who did approximately the same. Again and again we saw to it, or we tried to eliminate everything that could lead to bad conditions.
Q Witness, did you in this connection, and I do not want any Court No. II, Case No. 4.details about it, deal with the food and the clothing for the inmates?
A Yes, that problem was always in our program when we had discussions with the works managers.
Q.- Witness, you did hear during this trial, didn't you, about the work being carried out by the punitive details which was being carried out by order of the commandantur in individual enterprises. What did you know at the time about the punitive details or punitive commandos as they were called? If you did know anything about it, what did you do about it?
A.- The two terms "punitive detail" or "punitive commando" were not known to me. And in two cases, as I can recall, I did hear of punitive measures, and I would like to describe those two cases here, if you don't mind. It was approximately 1940 when the works manager of Flossenbuerg informed us that a small group of inmates -- I believe 10 or 12 of them -would be recruited and compiled and put to work in a swamp near the plant there and that they had to carry stones all day long, which was senseless. They had to walk around in circles and carry those heavy stones. The works manager, of course, was so angry about it that he informed us of it immediately. And in the absence of Dr. Salpeter at the time I submitted the case to Herr Pohl. He, of course, was just horrified as the other man was. I was having a conference with the inspector at the time who was Eicke -- or it could have been Gluecks -- by telephone, and he pointed out this madness to him. And he told him that this was to be stooped immediately. This was within a few days or a short period of time. That is the reason that the inmates no longer appeared in that swanp and the man in charge of the stone quarry, the SS leader, was transferred as a punishment. According to my recollection this was in 1940. The reaction on the part of the commander was that he now was antagonistic toward the works manager, who, as he said, got himself mixed up in those things. He tried to cause trouble for the manager for this, trouble of all kinds; and he particularly tried to charge him with favoritism of the inmates, and we had to transfer him to a different camp.
Q.- Herr Mummenthey, isn't it correct that the works manager Flossenbuerg, was being persecuted by the commander more and more while he was in Gross-Rosen and then later on in another concentration camp so that in the end you had to transfer him to St Georgen?
A.- I couldn't tell you for certain, but I can only assume that due to the incidents that it didn't take very long until the commander in Gross-Rosen started trouble against the works manager, so that after a little while he had to be transferred to St. Georgen. Again there were intrigues against him there, apparently upon suggestion by the commander of Flossenbuerg; so that finally in order to help this man find his peace and his rest, we sent him to Beneschau where he didn't have too much to do with the inmates.
Q.- You told us you have a second incident?
A.- Yes. The commander of Flossenbuerg was transferred as a punishment. I already discussed that before. Now, the second incident which I can remember was that the works manager of Mauthausen from St. Georgen informed me that the camp in order to transport stones for construction work and projects of the camp, was using a column of inmates. This column was called by the camp a transport column. The works manager stated that he was under the impression that this was a punitive measure or something similar to that. I also submitted that case to Herr Pohl after the works manager had protested repeatedly to the commander about this measure. The measure as such had nothing to do with our enterprise. That was senseless and it was nothing but madness. I know that Herr Pohl also took care of that matter because the transport columns were then eliminated, and the transportation of stones was carried out by vehicle. The vehicles for the most part were furnished by us, or then by the camp, or by some transportation firm near there. This matter was also looked upon by the commander as an interference in his plans; and as he was scolded for that reason, he tried to hold it against both myself and the works manager because we had reported it to Herr Pohl.
Q.- Did you notice any further incidents -- I mean, you yourself personally, did you ever hear of any incidents on the part of the works managers where such mistreatment of human beings took place?
A.- Personally; I never did notice it, even as often as I was in the plants, nor were we informed of it. The two incidents which I just mentioned were used in order to inform the works managers that they should never permit such punitive measures to be carried out within the plant area; and I remember that the works managers upon one of my questions or a question submitted by a colleague, answered that this would take place. The thing as described here by the witnesses cannot be understood by me. I must say that I can't understand them.
After 1944 there was such a thing which was called Klinker-S.K. in Oranienburg. I believe I would have heard about it somehow, and I am quite sure that I would have interferred there as I interferred every other time there was such a thing.
Q.- Witness, do you remember that the witness Bickel answered a question submitted to him by the Prosecution: Did you have any knowledge about the punitive detail in Nuengamme; and he wanted to answer that by saying yes and giving a long explanation; whereupon the prosecution interrupted him. Do you remember that? Anyway, I would like to ask you if you did know of a punitive detail or punitive measure in Neuengamme?
A.- I can tell you to the best of my conscience, no. The works manager never did tell me anything about it. My colleague Schondorf never did mention anything of the kind when he was there several time, and when I visited the camp, I never saw anything in that camp where punitive details or punitive measures were being carried out.
Q.- In all those cases where you heard of certain things which were going on and which were not correct according to your opinion and which were disregarding the principles of humanity toward the inmates, you interferred, did you, witness, by having conferences with the camp commanders and by reporting it to Pohl, didn't you?
A.- Yes, I can't express it any other way. All I can say is that whenever I heard something, I tried to eliminate it. I did my very best whatever was within my power not only to prevent it but to stop it entirely forever after. No matter how many disadvantages were connected with this -
THE PRESIDENT: Go ahead and finish.
A.- Whenever I could do something about it, I reported them to Pohl.
Q.- You said you were not afraid to etc.
A.- Yes, I continued even though there were disadvantages. I reported those things to Pohl.
BY THE PRESIDENT:
Q.- And when you reported them to Pohl, he was interested and sympathetic?
A.- Yes, Your Honor. I'd have to to say that whenever I submitted such a thing to Herr Pohl, he usually would slam his fist on the table and say, "what kind of a Sckweinerei is this". I can refer to this occurrence which was described by Bickel where Herr Pohl went straight to Neuengamme in order to have the administrative leader relieved there, and the commander also later on. He had been convinced himself about the conditions which were prevailing there.
Q.- And when he found the conditions were bad, he removed the works leader and the commander at Neuengamme?
A.- The commander -- the Administrative leader, I said first of all, the administrative leader.
Q.- Yes.
A.- He was responsible for the food and clothing, etc.
Q.- And also the camp commander?
A.- The camp commander was then removed later on. I don't know if that was the reason or not.
Q.- You said a few minutes ago when you told him about the transport columns that he got in touch with either Gluecks or Eicke and told them that would have to stop?
A.- Yes.
Q.- All right.
A.- And that actually happened afterwards.
Q.- And it did stop when Herr Pohl gave the order, the abuse, the cruelty stopped?
A.- Those incidents which I reported to him, yes, were eliminated quite so.
BY DR. FROESCHMANN:
Q.- Herr Hummenthey, let me ask you another question in this connection. What was the relationship actually between you and Pohl? Was it very friendly or did Herr Pohl also show you his other side?
A.- You can't call your relationship very friendly, and Herr Pohl, I am sure, will forgive me if I say that he was very excitable on several occasions, and that was the reason why he was not a very pleasant superior.
Q.- Didn't he throw you out of the room on a few occasions?
A.- Yes, that also occurred.
Q.- Yes, I just wanted to mention that in order to describe your relationship between yourself and Herr Pohl. Now, then, Mummenthey, this is the last question in this connection. You described what you saw, how you looked at those things, and what you did about it. Where were the limits of your possibilities to carry out those things which you considered correct?
A.- I was a co-business manager of DEST GmbH, and I was a so-called Office Chief, or Amtschef. The limits of my possibilities could be found exactly there where my competencies ended. Very severe regulations and the regulations concerning secrecy resulted in the fact that although things which were going on in the concentration camps remained secret.
That can probably be seen by the fact that I had a tense relationship with all the camp commanders, and I was actually on the warpath against them. The works managers knew very well whenever I would hear something about it, I would not only report it to the higher-ups but also follow up the case.
A.- And that actually caused open hostility between the two. I know for certain that the commander of Mauthausen was only waiting for one opportunity to get my skin somehow. The workers manager of Mauthausen, Herr Walter, pointed out to me repeatedly by saying, "Herr Mummenthey, watch out. I believe they --" and when I say "they" he meant the Kommandantur " -- had something against you. They are trying to do something against you."
Even if I had some sort of an insight into the conditions in the concentration camps at the time, the way I know things were going on today is from the documents which were introduced by the Prosecution and in other trials, my possibilities would have stopped at the gates of the con centration camp.
Q.- Herr Mummenthey, we have repeatedly come back to Document R-129. That is the famous order, according to which the commanders of concentration camps were also responsible -- were to be responsible -- for the enterprises. Do you have to add anything to your testimony with reference to that order? Coula a responsibility be derived from that or could responsibility, from you, for whatever the camp commanders then did?
A.- In this order the W offices are not mentioned at all. It is stated there that for the inmates which were being employed in the camps, in the enterprises, rather, the commanders alone were responsible. It is furthermore stated that they tad to be of a certain character before they could become such people.
Q.- What, according to your opinion, was then the co-responsibility of works managers which is referred to in the order?
A.- This co-responsibility restricted and limited itself to the fact that the works manager would point out difficulties to the commanders. His duty, therefore, stopped when he made that report to the commander. According to that order, he couldn't do more than that, and he was not permitted to do more than that. Otherwise, he would have exceeded his duties as contained in that order.
Our repeated and current measures show that the commanders regarded the whole thing as an interference within their field of tasks. It is difficult to make it understandable today how powerful a commander was. I believe that in one of the documents, as intro duced by the Prosecution -- I read in one of the affidavits by some sort of an investigator of the SS tribunals, that the commanders were the most powerful human beings, and they were the ones who could decide on life or death.
Q.- Therefore, witness, you are only confirming what the witness Bickel said?
A.- Yes, all I do is confirm it. The commanders possessed an arrogance, the degree of which could be found only very seldom. And, as most of the time they had a high rank -- as a matter of fact, a much higher rank than I had -- they also tried to remind me of it, and whenever they wanted to do something really special they would simply interrupt a conference in a military way.
Q.- Herr Mummenthey, just a moment ago you spoke about the individual measures which you carried out in order to better the food and clothing situation for the inmates, and I don't believe I have to talk about it any more. I would also appreciate it however if you would tell the Tribunal, something about the hygienic measures and sanitation within their place of work.
A.- As far as the sanitation in the camps was concerned, I believe it was in '41 or '42 that there were quite a few difficulties at the beginning, when the camps were being established. According to my recollection there were large epidemics at that time which attacked not only inmates but SS members as well. Quarantines were initiated in the camp, and for months and months sometimes. Of course, we did hear about those things, particularly since inmates did not come to the plant. During that period of time the plant was more or less idle. I also believe that the largest death rate which existed originated in those epidemics.
Q.- Did you ever receive any reports about deaths which occurred in both the enterprises and in the camps?
A.- No, neither in the camps nor in the enterprises, and in the monthly reports, as introduced by the plants which we received, we never did read any such things. I can't recall any such incident. I only know that in the monthly reports we did have certain figures concerning accidents in the plants and how they had been taken care of. But those accidents in the plants were investigated very carefully, and most of the time by investigators of the union, the workers' union. For example, the stone chiselers union or the brick workers union.
Q.- May I ask you a short question in this connection, witness. The witness Schwarz testified that the inmates were not insured against accidents, is that correct?
A.- The witness Schwarz is not a lawyer. Therefore, he didn't deal with those matters at the time, and I believe he is wrong in this connection. The inmates were insured as far as accidents were concerned, and they were insured on a double basis. First of all, they were insured according to a law which existed for the treatment of inmates, which law was then amended in 1936, or later on. It was also extended to the concentration camp inmates. As far as the inmates who were working in our enterprises, they were automatically insured against accidents with the workers' unions. They received a special contribution slip every year where the payments made to the Reich were contained, and they were used as a basis for the computation of contributions.
Q.- Therefore, it worked out this way, that these inmates were insured both in the brick factory as well as in the camp?
A.- Yes, quite so.
Q.- You were speaking about the hygienic situation of sanitation in the working place -
BY THE PRESIDENT:
Q.- Before you leave the question of insurance, do you mean that if an inmate was injured while he was at work that he himself received the benefit of some insurance?
A.- According to my opinion, yes. In any case we always filled out those forms as prescribed, and they went to the Main Administration office to either the Kommandantur, the Kommando, of that camp or then from there they were sent to the RSHA, when they were dealt with. The workers' union then contacted the RSHA or the Kommandantur, respectively.
I remember of an accident in Oranienburg which occurred in 1944 where an inmate was severely injured. I believe I happened to be there at the time when the investigators of the Workers' union came. The accident occurred in the morning, and in the afternoon the investigators were already there investigating the case. They took a record, and the entire matter was then further dealt with by other circles.
Q.- What happened? Who was paid any money?
A.- The man was severely injured and, therefore, he couldn't carry out any further work. The workers' union then paid him a pension. We received the figure as to how high the pension was, a copy of the figure.
Q.- Was this man an inmate of a concentration camp?
A.- Yes, indeed, your Honor.
Q.- And he actually received, through a labor organization, some money by reason of his injuries?
A.- Yes; because the accident had occurred in our plant, and he was the one who was suffering from it.
Q.- Well, you spoke of the workers' union. Were the workers in the concentration camps organized?
A.- Your Honor, that is a term as used in German insurance law; the compulsory insurance in enterprises for the individual branches is called "workers' union." This is a special term.
Q.- In English it is more like Group insurance.
A.- No, your Honor; it is more of a professional guild. It is insurance from the part of the enterprise.
Q.- And it includes every one in that guild or in that profession?
A.- Yes.
Q.- It is still group insurance.
What nationality was this man that was severely injured you mentioned a moment ago?
A.- According to my recollection, he was a German, Your Honor.
Q.- Well, did these insurance benefits extend to non-Germans?
A.- There was no difference made.
Q.- You mean if a Russian was injured in a plant so that he couldn't work he received money from the insurance?
A.- He should have received it because he was insured with our company.
Q.- Well, he was entitled to the money; whether he got it or not, he should have it -- the Russian, I mean?
A.- Yes, he should have received it through that professional guild which would then contact the RSHA, and he would receive it, of course, just like any other prisoner who was under arrest by order of a Justice Department order.
BY DR. FROESCHMAN:
Q Herr Mummenthey, do you know if the wives of such inmates who had suffered an accident in the plant would receive the pension directly, even if the man would still remain in the concentration camp or if he was in a hospital?
A That I couldn't tell you. I don't know how it was worked out.
Q Well, then, after this interesting talk we had in between, let's come back to hygenic measures which you carried out. I am now thinking of the following: Did you see to it that the food was served properly?
A Yes, I could use a small example here which could be extended to the other plant also. In the stone works in Oranienburg I had ordered on the basis of my observations that all the tables had to be set free at noon so that the inmates could sit and eat. They also made certain small stools where they could sit down and eat their meals. As far as the inmates were working outside in the open air are concerned, a special hall was constructed where the inmates could consume their food while sitting and place their dishes on the table. The food was brought in special containers from the camp and was carried by trucks, and I really couldn't say that it was no longer hot or warm, because I personally saw hot steam was coming out of those containers when the food was served.
JUDGE MUSMANNO: Dr. Froeschmann, haven't you covered that subject? You told us not only about the food being warm, but that there was stew, what was in the stew. Yesterday he told us all that.
DR. FROESCHMANN: Yes, yes, Witness, I believe we don't want to know all those things in detail. I just want to ask you a few more things.
Q (BY DR. FROESCHMANN: Did you write any applications and letters for those inmates and did you get than too?
A Yes. -
Q I mean, "yes", or "no".
A Yes, yes.
Q Did the inmates, when they were released, when you finally succeeded in releasing them from the concentration camp and bringing them back to civilian life, did you give them any certificates or letters of recommendation and what was their reaction to that?
AAfter the release of the inmates, and I mean also releases which did not take place according to our suggestion, there were all sorts of applications to work, and requests asking us to write a certificate, a certificate concerning their activity. Although a working contract did not exist between the enterprises and the individual inmates, I ordered the works management to write out those certificates in order to help the individual in his career.
Q Did you in Mauthausen take certain measures for the delousing of the inmates? How did it work out there?
A In 1944, we received a letter from the firm of Messerschmitt, according to which their civilians and the inmates were lousy. It occured suddenly they had turned in applications to the commanders, the works-managers, and they finally decided to interpolate me also. I immediately called for the works managers, also the commanders, and I heard that the possibility of elimination of lice was not given at the moment. They needed a special installation, which installation had not yet been created, whereupon I immediately contacted the organization "Todt" in Berlin and tried to get such equipment, but then again there were difficulties, but anyway, we succeeded in getting those machines and we brought them by truck to Mauthausen. The whole bad situation was eliminated immediately.
Q Witness, will you take a look at the last document, which is Exhibit 121, and which is Document NO-2318, as contained in Document Book V on page 13. This is an order by Pohl, dated the 26th of June, 1942, concerning the increased guarding of inmates and PW's. What do you have to say to the Tribunal about this. Was this carried out or not?
A No, it was not. I was always of the opinion that we were not competent for the guards and, therefore, we didn't have to deal with it, because we couldn't judge any actions and plants received their respective orders. May I again speak of the PW's in this connection?
Q Yes, please do.
A I already stated that with one exception, namely where PW's were employed in Bohemia who were taken out of Stalag, I simply did not know that PW's were working, but in St. Georgen, it had been planned on one occasion that Russian PW's should be trained as stone chiselors. When I was in the plants, I didn't see any PW's myself. When the witness Bickel said that there were PW's for a certain period of time, I can't deny that. I didn't see them myself, nor do I know that they were there. If they were there, they were probably working in the brick factory, therefore, not in armament. Had I heard of any cases where prisoners of war were working amongst the inmates and they were working in inmate garb, I would have assumed that they were sent to a camp by virtue of an exceptional violation or a special warrant and they were committed to a concentration camp, and had lost their status as PW's in the concentration camp for that period of time. As far as I can recall, the witness Bickel testified to something similar. Had I ever seen any PW's working in the plants in uniform or if anything of the kind had been reported to me, of course, immediately, I would have inquired about the system where the prisoners of war had come from, why they had been sent to a concentration camp, etc. etc., and how they were being employed.
Q That is all you can say, is it, Witness? Now, Herr Mummenthey, the last question, the last question in this connection. Did you also have roll call eliminated?
A We worked again and again to have those roll calls eliminated and we banged our heads against that hard wall, but still we did succeed after a few years to have them eliminated completely.
Q Does the same apply to marching forth and marching back?
A Wherever we found a possibility to do so, we did, particularly by establishing small billets for the inmates immediately in the plant. I would say that we finally succeeded in eliminating roll call.
DR. FROESCHMANN: Your Honor, I have to speak about the SS now. However I think it is an opportunity to call a recess.
THE PRESIDENT: Let me ask you just one question before recessing.
BY THE PRESIDENT:
Q How many DEST plants were engaged in making war material?
A Flossehbuerg, St. Georgen with plane parts, Oranienburg with hand grenades, and Rothau was working with the taking apart of airplane motors. I do not know if you can call that part of armament activities. I believe so.
Q And in those plants that you just mentioned inmates were employed?
A Yes.
Q And foreign inmates were employed?
A Yes, quite so.
THE PRESIDENT: All right, now we will recess.
THE MARSHAL: The Tribunal will recess for 15 minutes.
(A recess was taken.)