It had its own treasury and it paid construction bills independently. In certain cases up to 100,000 marks, in individual cases; if the amounts were over 100,000 marks for an individual case, then the construction inspectorate only had to obtain the approval for this expenditure. Payment of amounts above 100,000 marks was also made by the construction inspectorate. After all, there was no higher agency which had its own treasury. As far as the authority to give instructions is concerned, I must say that a construction inspectorate could never issue an immediate directive to a construction management. But it also had to channel it through central construction management. But a construction management, on the other hand, was not allowed either to by-pass the central construction management or to turn directly to the construction inspectorate, or to turn to Amtsgruppe C at Berlin, directly.
These construction inspectorates which I have just mentioned were subordinated on the highest level to Amtsgruppe C at Berlin, or Doctor Kammler in various tasks, directly.
In order to avoid confusion here, I would like to explain Amtsgruppe C. In reality it was so that within Amtsgruppe C there was a special office which represented the top level. The Tribunal has already referred to the distribution plan in Document Book 2, NO-1288, Exhibit 44, on page 30 of the German text in this document. The Office C-5 has been listed as a central construction inspectorate. That is, as the superior agency for the Reich Construction Inspectorate, the individual main departments, it can be seen that everything that is connected with construction matters at all is incorporated and coordinated in this central construction inspectorate.
With the Main Department C-5, the supervision over construction, that is, C-5-1; and the Main Department C-5-2, the budget and the construction service; and Main Department C-5-3, Raw Materials; and Main Department C-5-4, the Plenipotentiary General for the Construction Economy.
That is raw material and construction material, and allocation of labor.
I believe that it becomes evident from this that everything that had to do with administrative construction matters has been coordinated here. This central construction inspectorate did not have the power to exercise supervision over the construction inspectorate.
Dr. Kammler carried that out personally. Dr. Kammler also personally took care in dealing with all approvals for construction which amounted to more than 100,000 marks. That is, the construction Which had to be authorized and approved by a top-level agency.
I believe that I have shown sufficiently now the construction and the authority the construction agencies had. I stated at the lowest level, the construction management, and then I went over to the central construction management, to the construction inspectorate in Amtsgruppe C. The remaining offices were specialized offices. They were the highest authorities which worked in cooperation with the remaining Reich agencies which had to deal with the tasks which are contained in the assignment plan, just mentioned. The tasks were coordinated in such a way that the sphere of work of one office would not overlap with that of another office. That is, every office had to carry out its work independently. For the occupied territories, the organization at the lower level, that is, the construction managements and the con -
JUDGE MUSMANNO: Dr. Mayer, much of this discussion is very general; one office doesn't overlap another, and expressions of that kind don't present a very clear picture -- to me. I wish we could be a little more tangible and objective and let us get a little more directly to the charges in the indictment. I think we have heard a great deal now about his office and about construction managements, and so on. Can't we become a little more responsive to the things that he has to answer for? You see, unless you control this interrogation and keep in mind always what you have to apply to in the indictment, we can just go on here indefinitely, and not bet a clear picture of his responsibility, if any.
DR. MAYER: Very well, Your Honor. The time has come now for something which the President has suggested. Now we want to show by that example just how the cooperation was carried out. The purpose of the explanation is to explain that the tasks which the defendant had were completely independent and that they had nothing to do with the execution of the construction, and with the task of other offices. After this explanation and the example, I shall come immediately to the concrete question.
BY DR. MAYER:
Q: Witness, will you please give us an account of the example which has been mentioned before?
A: A construction is to be carried out at one place with the cost of 2,000,000 marks. It is to be established at a certain place. The competent agency, the construction management, compiles the sketches for the construction. For these plans it obtains the approval of Dr. Kammler at Berlin.
On that occasion it also requests from Dr. Kammler the furnishing of the quotas for the construction, that is to say, the quotas of raw materials. After the allocation of these quotas of raw material to Office C-V, negotiations are had with the Plenipotentiary General for the construction economy. The Plenipotentiary General approves the quotas of raw materials. Then he orders the district commissioner to furnish these raw materials to the construction management in the form of certificates which can be changed into material on the free construction market.
The construction management now has the approval to carry out the construction. Now it orders the central construction management to appoint a construction management for that certain locality. The construction management carries out this construction, and with the construction certificates it obtains the necessary construction material, After the building has been completed, it receives the bill from the constructing enterprise. Then it turns that over to the inspectorate, and, since the amount is two million marks, the inspectorate must obtain approval from Dr. Kammler in order to spend these funds. The permission is given and the bills are paid by the treasury of the construction inspectorate. That is the procedure in such a construction project when an amount of two million marks is involved.
Q. In order to avoid any misunderstandings later on, I should like to point out that in the occupied territories, in the East, a somewhat different organization was established, which is explained in Document 2128, Exhibit 331, in Document Book 12. I believe you do not have to go into any further details at the moment. However, if it should be necessary, we can refer again to this document. I now want to ask you, after you have explained the official situation to us, witness, by virtue of your activity did you collaborate with other offices of Amtsgruppe C?
A. Office C-II did not have to do that because I did not need any raw materials from my construction enterprises nor did I need any labor. I know construction expenses arose and therefore this work was indepen dent from these fields of work of the offices concerned.
Q. Did any collaboration take place with other office groups of the WVHA and their subordinate offices?
A. No. During my entire activity in the WVHA I have never had any negotiations or discussions with other office groups or any offices which were included in these office groups.
Q. Did you therefore ever request any inmates or did you cooperate in such an order?
A. No, I never did that.
Q. Witness, I want to direct your attention to Document Book 20. There is a series of documents which contain the reports of Kammler and of the tearing down of the Warsaw ghetto. These are documents NO-2503, Exhibit 507, on page 114 of the English text and page 159 of the German test, and the subsequent documents, Exhibit 508, 509, 510, and 511. I therefore ask you, witness, did you have anything to do with this action, and did you have any knowledge of it?
A. The action did not come to my knowledge, nor did I obtain any knowledge of these reports. All these reports were compiled by Dr. Kammler, and with the exception of the last they have the dictation mark of Office C-V. The last document is a secret letter directly from Dr. Kammler to the Reichsfuehrer SS. I should like to state in this connection that the corroboration of an agency of Amtsgruppe C, aside from the person of Dr. Kammler in this demolition and removal of the debris, is understandable to me because the central construction management at Warsaw, which is mentioned in the last document, in the document to which you are referring just now, with regard to the order about construction activities in the East and occupied territories, was immediately subordinated to the economies with the Higher SS and Police leader.
In this document it becomes evident that the work was discontinued by order of the Higher SS and Police leader, and that therefore the authority over this allocation of labor was not with Amtsgruppe C but that it rested with the Higher SS and Police leader. As far as I am informed, Amt C-II was not participating at all in this action, and, as I said before, I did not have any knowledge of what happened there.
Q. The document to which I have referred is Document 2128, Exhibit 331, in Document Book XXII, and this document shows the cooperation of the SS economies with the Higher SS and Police leader.
THE PRESIDENT: Document Book XII?
DR. MAYER: I beg your pardon, I made a mistake. It is Document Book XII.
Q. Witness, were all your collaborators members of the SS?
A. No, not at all. At the end of 1942 the Office C-II besides me was composed of twenty-five members. Of these, sixteen were civilian employees, and of the five officers who worked in my office three were specialist officers, that is, during the war they had been conscripted for that assignment, and during the time they were serving with the WVHA they only had been given a rank in the Waffen SS. However, as soon as they left their position in the WVHA, they again would lose their temporary grade. This did not make their membership in the SS mandatory. At the end of 1943 the office only had about ten to twelve people in it, and more than half of these people were civilian employees. Towards the end of 1944 only four employees had remained, and then the entire staff was composed of civilian employees.
Q. What is the reason for the decrease of personnel?
A. The reason for the decrease of personnel was war conditions, which actually caused us to discontinue our work which was dependent on the peacetime assignments of Dr. Kammler, that is, the preparation of normal construction activity after the end of the war for the construction assignments which had been compiled in Office C-II.
Q. You have mentioned the special staff of Kammler, who has been mentioned repeatedly in this trial. When and how did you obtain knowledge of the existence of this staff?
A. I heard of Kammler's special staff in the year 1943 when Dr. Kammler moved his offices from the WVHA to the Berlin suburb of Grunewald.
At the time I heard that in the same street and same suburb but another building a so-called fighter staff (Jaegerstab) had been established, and Dr. Kammler was also in charge of it. Sometime later I heard something about a so-called armament staff, and in connection with it I also heard of the special staff, which was also directed by Dr. Kammler. Its top letter was not the WVHA, but this was a task which was completely outside the WVHA.
THE PRESIDENT: Counsel, just a minute. You see, this is all of importance only in connection with the use of labor. The only relationship between all of this building program and the complex organization and the indictment is in connection with the use of labor and, of course, the construction of concentration camps, crematoria, and things of that kind. But whether Kammler had a special supervisory staff or a hundred doesn't make any difference. I'm still in the dark as to who ordered the labor used by the construction management or contractor in the building of our two million mark building. Where did the workmen come from and who procured them? Will you direct your questions to that, if you please?
DR. MAYER: Yes, Your Honor. I shall come to these questions. However, the defendant can only answer these questions with no. The explanation for this no can not be given other than to show that in his work he had nothing to do with all these fields. Therefore, I will try to explain that the special staff of Kammler was something entirely different than if it were subordinated to Amtsgruppe C. Therefore, no connection can be assumed there. I must describe the special staff of Kammler very briefly. The Prosecutor has not made any concrete charges against the defendant so far, therefore, I have to deal with the questions on a large framework in order to show that no connection can be established.
THE PRESIDENT: Let me ask the witness one question, first. Do you know where the laborers came from who built the buildings which Kammler had approved?
THE WITNESS: No, Your Honor. I did not know that at the time.
THE PRESIDENT: Did you know that at any time when you were connected with Office C-II? Did you know from where the labor was to come?
THE WITNESS: Your Honor, I never had any contact with any construction agency. From my office I was unable to judge whether the civilian workers were used by construction agencies or if inmates were used at the construction places. As far as I know, inmates were used at construction places.
THE PRESIDENT: That answers the question. Now, who decided what kind of labor to use?
THE WITNESS: Probably the agency decided that or the agency gave the orders which also caused these buildings to be constructed.
THE PRESIDENT: No. No. Somebody had to hire the laborers. Who was it? Was it the construction management?
THE WITNESS: Your Honor, I can not say that from my own experience. In my opinion, probably the following procedure was followed.
THE PRESIDENT: No. No. No. That leads us off into new fields.
Do you know who hired the laborers? Do you know who procured the labor for these construction projects? Do you know?
THE WITNESS: No, Your Honor. I did not know that.
THE PRESIDENT: Now counsel, I see your point. You must explain why he does not know.
DR. MAYER: Yes, Your Honor.
THE PRESIDENT: All right. Pick it up where you left off, then.
Q We were about to discuss a special staff of Kammler. Did you have anything to do with the special staff?
A No. I never had anything to do with it.
Q You have seen from the evidence which has been presented by the Prosecution that Kammler had to carry out a number of tasks in this special project which were in the field of armament, or where he had to deal with some other secret measures. I am referring here to the fighter program, the transfer of the industries into subterranean fields, the weapons program and the construction enterprise S-III at Ohrdruf, also the so-called A and B measures. Did you participate in these measures either within or outside your office C-2?
A No. I did not participate in this during my entire activity.
THE PRESIDENT: You have told us so many things that he did not so, try to find out what this witness did do and see to. I have not heard of anything that he did do.
DR. MAYER: I believe, Your Honor, that I have explained now that the defendant did not do anything; but those things which are contained in Document 1288 in Document Book 2, and which have been described there as his field of assignment.
THE PRESIDENT: All right. Now we are watching the document. It is on page 117 of Volume 2.
JUDGE MUSMANNO: Page 176.
THE PRESIDENT: It is also page 5.
JUDGE MUSMANNO: I see.
DR. MAYER: On page 5 of the English text begins the task of Office C-II.
THE PRESIDENT: Special Building letter?
THE WITNESS: Yes. They are called special building matters.
DR. MAYER: The witness will state just what brought about this title and how it can be explained.
THE PRESIDENT: No. I do not care about titles. I am -
DR. MAYER: Here it is further stated what he had to do in Section C-II, ZV. He has explained further the Main Department. Here it is stated in this connection just how this was only a theoretical plan and just how actual tasks were carried out by him in the form of construction projects and how far he dealt with these matters. In this connection, he has stated that his activities became less and less because as a result of the development of the war, many tasks were discontinued.
THE PRESIDENT: I remember, he testified about home planning after the war and buildings for returned soldiers and all of that; but what did he do during the war?
DR. MAYER: During the war his main task was the preparation of tasks which were to be carried out in peacetime, that is to say, the planning of houses and the collaboration of the construction agencies of the Reich and Reich Commissioners in the execution of the order of the Fuehrer about the construction program of housing after the war. Therefore, the witness has also stated that his office could be completely discontinued before the war without any damage.
THE PRESIDENT: But he said in 1943 these plans for after the war were abandoned due to the pressure of the war. So if you like, let us start with 1943. What did he do then.
DR. MAYER: What he still had to do was to take care of the planning and the sketches of the hospital buildings. The witness has stated that his work office was destroyed through air attacks and he had to begin his work anew. He had also stated that at the end of 1944 and early in 1945, there hardly was any more work accumulating in his office.
At the end, he had only four collaborators.
THE PRESIDENT: Will you look at C-II/2, Buildings for Armament, Ammunition and Signal Purposes. That was not for after the war, was it?
DR. MAYER: The witness has stated in this connection that the communication facilities were taken away already from the beginning because we had an agency which was competent for this in the Operational Main Office which worked on these matters during the war. He stated that he had drafted the sketches for a practice shooting field and that he had nothing to do with it. It was a rifle range. The witness has also stated that Kammler although there was practically no work to be done, did not want to discontinue this whole field of task. He made the request in the field of C-I, C-II-1 and C-II/2 because Kammler maintained the point of view that this was a work distribution plan which was to clarify Kammler's competence. However, it was not to be a plan of work to be carried out by the officers. Therefore, it was completely unimportant, just how much of this organizational chart was to continue with it. After the war, Kammler wanted to estend his Amtsgruppe-C. Therefore, he wanted to secure competence for himself. This organizational plan actually did not say anything about what work was to be carried out during the war. What actually happened could only be carried out by the witness himself, and he has expressed that.
THE PRESIDENT: Well, can you tell me one thing that this defendant did in Office C-II in connection with the war?
DR. MAYER: May I suggest, Your Honor, that you ask the witness that question so that he can repeat just what he had expressed yesterday in his own words?
THE PRESIDENT: I will take a chance. Answer the question, will you, Witness? Excluding things that had to do with postwar planning, what did you do in Office C-II that had to do with the war?
Court No. II, Case No. 4.
A Your Honor, I have already described such tasks. I have stated that in the Department C-V I dealt with construction matters in preparing training centers for the Waffen-SS, etc. That is to say, I worked on the establishment of two troop training centers. That was a lot of work which took up a long time of work because this was procedure extremely complicated and therefore it took up
THE PRESIDENT: All right; go ahead. That's enough about that. What else did you do?
A The Department for the Establishment of Army Hospitals was a war assignment because here the basic planning for the tasks of army hospitals was dealt with and army hospitals from 150 to 300 to 400 --
THE PRESIDENT: All right. I know. I know. Army hospitals; that is the second. What else?
A Well, these were for the most part the things I dealt with during the war, your Honor. I have already stated that three main departments were actually unimportant and two main departments actually carried out the work -
THE PRESIDENT: I just wanted to know the ones that were important. I want to know all of the projects connected with the war which you had anything to do with. First, SS training centers, second army hospitals. Anything else?
A No, these were the main tasks, your Honor, however they were very large tasks.
THE PRESIDENT: Did you have anything to do with the erection or repair of any building in a concentration camp in any way?
A No, I never had anything to do with it. In this connection could I perhaps point out, Your Honor, that in the same chart which has just been referred to, that is, Document 12, page 8, in the construction work in the concentration camps had been listed under another office.
THE PRESIDENT: Who? Go ahead.
Court No. II, Case No. 4.
A It was office -- that was what I wanted to say, your Honor. That all construction in the concentration camps was dealt with by another office.
THE PRESIDENT: Well, which office?
A That was C-1.
THE PRESIDENT: That was Office C 1/2.
DR. MAYER: Yes.
A Yes.
THE PRESIDENT: Well, then, the building of concentration camp buildings was in your Amtsgruppe, in Office C?
A The charts of the Ministerial level were concentrated in Office C-1.
THE PRESIDENT: That's in Kammler's Division -- under Kammler?
A Yes, it's in the Office Group which was directed by Kammler.
THE PRESIDENT: But not in the Office Group that you were attached to. It was the same Amtsgruppe but a different Amt?
A It was in the same Office Group but another office. Yes, that's correct.
THE PRESIDENT: So if crematoria or other buildings in the concentration camp were constructed it was done by Office C-1 including maintenance and repairs?
A I cannot answer this question, your Honor, because I did not have any knowledge of the existence of gas chambers.
THE PRESIDENT: I said if --- if any were built after the WVHA was organized the work was done by Office C-1.
A If at the top level this task had to be dealt with then the Office C-1 would have been competent. However, I personally am unable to say whether actually these tasks were handled there.
THE PRESIDENT: I know you weren't in C-1 so you didn't see the plans being made but that's where the work fed into the organization, isn't it? In C-1?
A Whether crematoria and death chambers were the task of C-1 Court No. II, Case No. 4.I am unable to say, your Honor.
THE PRESIDENT: Well, construction in concentration camps was under C-1, wasn't it?
A Construction in the concentration camps? Yes, they were dealt with by C-1.
THE PRESIDENT: Also prisoner-of-war camps?
A I was surprised that prisoner-of-war camps were listed at all in the organizational work plan. As far as I know until the end of the war the Supreme Commander of the Wehrmacht was competent in these matters. I only heard in the course of this trial and have seen from the prosecution's documents that towards the end of 1944 the competence was transferred or had been transferred to the Chief of the Reserve Army Heinrich Himmler.
THE PRESIDENT: Now, I want to make this absolutely certain; any building, either original construction, extension or maintenance in the construction of concentration camps came within the competence of Office C-1?
A No, your Honor. That's not correct. The repair work and construction work up to a certain size and extent were never dealt with by the top level agency but was the task of lower agencies. Up to 5,000 marks was the task of the Central Construction Management and up to 100,000 marks it was the task of the Construction Inspectorate.
THE PRESIDENT: Are you talking about concentration camps now?
A Yes, your Honor, I am talking about all of the work but all of the work that was carried out in the concentration camps.
THE PRESIDENT: Well, back of the Construction Inspectorate was Amt C-5, was it not?
A Yes, the Central Construction Inspectorate and its Agency C-5-. That's correct.
BY THE PRESIDENT: All rights is that all construction work and all maintenance somewhere within the scope of Amt C?
Court No. II, Case No. 4.
AA certain size and extent; where it was more than 100,000 marks it was an individual case.
Q Well, including in the work which came within the scope of Office C was all of the construction work in the concentration camps?
A I don't know how I should answer the question, your Honor.
Q Just answer it by telling me the truth.
A Yes, I am only telling the truth here. I wanted to say was perhaps the translation was not correct here and you did not understand it correctly.
Q Well, I will state the question again; all construction or maintenance work in concentration camps came within the competence of Office C?
A No, your Honor, the repair work and maintenance work were small construction enterprises which were not dealt with by C but which were dealt with the lower construction agencies independently, completely independently.
Q You mean under 100,000 marks?
A Under 100,000 marks the Construction Inspectorate and under 5,000 marks it was the Central Construction Management.
Q Well, all right. Over 100,000 marks what I said was true?
A Over 100,000 marks the Amtsgruppe C was competent.
Q And between 5,000 and 100,000 marks the Construction Inspect orate was competent?
A The construction inspectorate, yes.
Q And the Construction Inspectorate was subordinate to Kammler was it not?
A Yes.
THE PRESIDENT: Well, that completes the circle, now. Go ahead Well, we only have a couple of minutes. Would you like to start at the end of the recess?
DR. MAYER: Yes.
Court No. II, Case No. 4.
THE MARSHAL: The Tribunal is in recess until 1:45.
(A recess was taken)
AFTERNOON SESSION (The hearing reconvened at 1345 hours, 25 June 1947.)
THE MARSHAL: The Tribunal is again in session.
DR. MAYER: May I continue, Your Honors?
MAX KIEFER--Resumed DIRECT EXAMINATION (Continued) BY DR. MAYER:
Q. Witness, this morning you explained that you did know of the existence of a special staff Kammler. However, you told us that you didn't know the measures and the tasks of that organization. Now, I'd like to ask you in conclusion, what did you know about the constrution brigades which Kammler used?
A. The term construction brigades I heard for the first time in 1942. At the time it was mentioned in connection with the labor assignment of inmates in order to eliminate damage caused by bombs in larger cities. When these construction brigades were established and how they were used I didn't know at the time. Then in 1944, towards the end of 1944, I heard of the so-called railroad construction brigade. That was in connection with the following thing. I had returned from a trip from A rolsen to Berlin, a trip which usually took a few hours by train. It took me three days at that time. When I reported back to the deputy of Kammler, I spoke with him about the heavy damage which I had seen on the way back, in the station of Kassel. It was on that occasion that Prof. Dr. Schleif told me that an agreement had been reached between the Reichsfuehrer Himmler and the railroads, or, rather, the German Traffic Ministry, that railroad construction brigades were to be established or had been established--I don't recall, in order to repair the damage caused to railroad tracks. I understood at the time that those railroad construction brigades were under the technical supervision of the railroad companies to be used to eliminate the bottleneck which had been caused two hundred thousand wagons and carriages to get stuck in the various stations all over Germany.
Those were the two occasions on which I heard about the construction brigades and railroad construction brigades; and that applies to the whole period of my activity.
Q. Witness, I shall show you a few documents. Now, take a look at Document 1292 in Document Book III, Exhibit 56, on Page 51 of the German and Page 46 of the English Book. It is a letter of Kammler's to Gluecks, dated the 10th of March 1942; and it deals with the assignment of prisoners of war, inmates, and Jews in order to carry out the construction program of the SS-WVHA, Amtsgruppe C; and that is in 1942, in the third economic year of the war. I should like to ask you, Witness, did you have any knowledge about that document at the time?
A. I don't recall having had that document in my hands. I can see on the second page that it says there, "to be circulated". It is quite possible that I saw it at the time. I probably read that; and as it actually didn't deal with my own task, I just passed it on. This document has the file note "C V", and, therefore, as for the field of work it is in no connection with my office, what so ever.
Q. As the next document I would like to show you, in Document Book 21, document number 2611, Exhibit 366, which is on Page 1 of the English and Page 1 of the German document book. It is a letter by Pohl to Himmler, dated 29 July 1944 concerning allocation of the first and fifth SS Construction Brigade. At the same time I want you to look at NO 2615 in the same document book, Exhibit 267, Page 3 of the English and Page 2 of the German book. This is an enclosure to the letter which I just mentioned. It is a report of Kammler of 29 July 1944 concerning the assignment of both the First and Fifth SS Construction Brigades when setting up defense positions and supply lines for the V-1 and V-2 in the West. Did you have any knowledge of these two documents?
A. No, these two documents were unknown to me. Both of them were stamped "military secret" or "secret" respectively, and they did not deal with my field of task. Therefore, I was not to be informed of them.
Q. As the last document in this connection, I want you to take a look at the document from Document book 6, which is document 2222 PS, Exhibit 178, Page 102 of the English and Page 90 of the German Document Book. It contains an affidavit by a certain George Peiper of 2 May 1945 and deals with the assignment of the Third SS Construction Brigade.
The affidavit in the German contains five pages, and unfortunately, in the English Document Book, Your Honor, you have only the first page. I have already asked the Prosecution to have the second page also translated. However, I do not know whether the Tribunal has the second page.
MR. ROBBINS: I understood from co-counsel that this document we would be reached about the recess time, and I have made arrangements to have it brought up about that time.
JUDGE PHILLIPS: I think we have it.
MR. ROBBINS: You have the complete document?
JUDGE PHILLIPS: 2222-PS.
MR. ROBBINS: I believe that not all of that affidavit was translated.
JUDGE PHILLIPS: We have two full pages and the signature. No, wait a minute - five pages.
MR. ROBBINS: Counsel advised me that there was one page missing, and I have had it checked on, and I understand that there is a page missing in the English text, and I turned it over to the Translation Department, but it has not been returned to me yet.
THE PRESIDENT: Document 2615, the one you just spoke about a moment ago in Book 21, consists of two letters.
DR. MAYER: I did not quite get that. Would you mind repeating that a little bit louder?
THE PRESIDENT: In Document Book 21 there were two exhibits that you just referred to, the first a letter from Pohl, and next, Document 2615 -
DR. MAYER: No, I am talking about Document Book 11 .
THE PRESIDENT: Well, I know, but a few minutes ago you were talking about this. The writer of the letter, 2615 , does not appear. Do you know who it was --- "SS Gruppenfuehrer and General Lieutenant of the Waffen SS" -
MR. ROBBINS: Kammler, Your Honor.
BY DR. MAYER:
Q. Witness, did you look at this document, 2222-PS, which is on Page 102 of the English and Page 90 of the German book? On the second page of that affidavit by George Pieper it says: "The head of the SS Construction Brigade was Sturmbannfuehrer Weigel, Berlin, Belitzhof, Nikolasee, Post Wannsee." I ask you now, witness, whether you knew that man. Did you know his task and his headquarters at that time?
A. Sturmbannfuehrer Weigel and his task were both unknown to me.