THE WITNESS: Your Honor, the RSHA, in my opinion, never interfered with our labor allocation. Unfortunately, the situation was that two different agencies worked in the concentration camps, and they gave their orders, and one agency did not know very much about the orders which were given by the other.
JUDGE MUSMANNO: Very well.
Q (By Dr. Belzer) Witness, what compelled you to make the statement here that the Jewish inmates also received their bonuses?
A I considered that the Jewish inmates as workers were also justified to receive these bonuses.
Q Therefore, that was your feeling of justice?
A Yes.
Q Did you have to overcome any resistance when you recommended this measure, or did Maurer immediately comply with all your wishes in that matter?
A Maurer immediately agreed with my suggestion, and he issued an order to that effect.
Q Were any special regulations in existence about the labor allocation of inmates, who issued them, and what were their contents?
A In the course of the years more and more orders were issued about the labor. In the summer of 1944 they were compiled into a service regulation for labor assignment of inmates including the bonus system, and Pohl issued that particular order.
Q Witness, in some other connection you have already answered the question in the negative, that the Office D-II was able to prevent or delay the release of concentration camp inmates. Does this apply to all cases, or wasn't the Office D-II in special cases the border limit of releases? I want to refer to Document NO-1293, Exhibit 99, in Document Book 4 where the witness Grimm has stated -- That is Page 85 of the German text and Page 68 of the English text, Exhibit 99 in Book 4.
A Is it an affidavit of Grimm? The Grimm affidavit is located in Document Book 11.
Q. I made a mistake; I confused these two documents. Please make a statement with regard to Document NO-1293, Exhibit 99 in Document Book 4.
A. It is an order by Gluecks to the camp commanders. The Office D-II did not receive any copy of this order. In this order, Gluecks criticized the inmates who had been committed to camps for a short time only and who were about to be drafted after release from the camp, and who had been used for secret production. He said that difficulties would arise after their release because they had obtained knowledge of secret matters -- he ordered that before inmates would be used for such production it should first be ascertained with the Political Department through the existing documents whether these inmates should be released. This had also to be done when we had specialist workers or skilled workers ---
BY JUDGE PHILLIPS:
Q. Why do you say D-II did not get a copy of this order?
A. Your Honor, I have already stated yesterday that collaboration between the offices was very bad.-
Q. I did not ask you that. Answer the question I asked you please. Why do you say that D-II did not get a copy of this order?
A. Well, that is shown by the distribution, Your Honor.
Q. In the order itself, right near the end of the order, under the title B, brackets, For Chief of Office D-II, Summary giving the number and working assignment of prisoners in the concentration camps." A part of the order directed it to D-II.
A. I beg your pardon, Your Honor; on the German copy of the Document NO-1239 I don't see anything about that.
Q. Well, it is in the English copy. I have the document he is talking about.
A. Exhibit 99, Document Book 4, Your Honor. That is NO-1293.
Q. I have got 1923. The English is NO-1923, Exhibit 99, in Document Book No. 4, at page 68.
THE PRESIDENT: Is it a letter?
JUDGE PHILLIPS: It is an order by Gluecks; an order by Gluecks dated Oranienburg, 13 of January 1944.
WITNESS: In the German Document Book, Your Honor, the letter has the date of the fourth of April, 1944.
JUDGE PHILLIPS: Well, there has been a mistake in the documents then. All right.
THE PRESIDENT: That is wrong, isn't it?
JUDGE PHILLIPS: There is a mistake in the document.
BY DR. BELZER (Counsel for the defendant Sommer):
Q. Therefore, the order of Gluecks was to prevent that in this way that inmates should be prevented from being released?
A. Yes, that is correct.
Q. Please make a statement with regard to Document NO-1971, Exhibit 312 in Document Book 11. It is on page 105 of the German text, and page 102 of the English text.
A. This is also an order by Gluecks as Inspector of the Concentration Camps from the year 1940. In this order he states that inmates who cannot be immediately released because their immediate release would cause a decrease in production because replacements cannot be trained immediately, that this matter must be reported to the RSHA by the political department so that appropriate consideration will be given to this matter in the case of an eventual release.
In the index of this order it is stated such inmates are not to be released although their release may be requested from the RSHA. That is not stated, however, in the document. Here it only states that they are not to be released immediately. I know that this time limit was within a 14-day period, and I have already made a statement about that yesterday.
Q. Now, please look at the Grimm document which you mentioned before. You have it in your hands now. Are Grimm's statements correct as far as they refer to this particular question?
A. On page 4 of his affidavit Grimm states that from his activity as labor assignment officer he knows that in 1942 an order was issued by Pohl to the concentration camps which entitle the concentration camp commanders to retain inmates who were necessary for the production in the camp, and to keep them in the camp until the end of the war. Grimm must have made a mistake here. This can only be the order where a 14-day period in mentioned.
THE PRESIDENT: Mr. Robbins, will you check Exhibit 99, please, and see whether it should be Document 1923 or 1293? I think it should be 1923.
MR. ROBBINS: Yes, Your Honor. I have made a note to do it, and I will report to you.
THE PRESIDENT: Because I notice in paging we have called it 68-A, -B, and -C -- a three-page document rather than a one -- Will you let us know which is the real exhibit?
MR. ROBBINS: Yes, sir.
THE PRESIDENT: Thank you.
BY DR. BELZER:
Q. Did you make any personal observations about the treatment of concentration camp inmates in economic enterprises?
A. Of the approximately 500 labor camps with industrial plants which, as far as I can recall, existed at the end of 1944, I only know very few of these plants; at the most, I know of ten of them, I, therefore , was only able to make very few personal observations. However, I know from statements by Maurer that the industries tried to give the inmates good accommodations and to treat them well because they were interested in maintaining these workers. After all, most of the workers were unskilled and in a very complicated process which lasted for several weeks they had to be trained in the special production tasks. Therefore, the plant was interested, since it had to reach a certain production rate prescribed by the Speer Ministry. To keep these workers, and in order to have them employed actually they had to treat them well.
Q. Witness, what do you know about the subordination of the so-called construction brigades, and the conditions which prevailed there?
A. In the summer of 1942, by order of Himmler, the so-called SS Construction Brigades were established. These brigades were construction units, and each of them had strength of approximately 1,000 inmates. They had to repair bomb damages in the German cities. That was what was intended. They were used for the first time afterwards in the West. Obergruppenfuehrer Dr. Kammler was in charge of the technical aspects of that, of those units. As far as I can recall, it was in the year 1943 when he also took charge over the other functions in these detachments and units. That is, he was responsible for all other matters which were connected with the construction brigades.
Later on, after an agreement between the Reich Minister of Transportation & Communication and Himmler, the so-called Railway Construction Brigades were also established. These detachments had an inmate strength of approximately 500 inmates. They were billeted in special trains which had been built for that purpose, and they were used to repair the railroad communications which had sustained bomb damage. These units also were subordinated to Kammler in disciplinary measures, and also in the technical aspects.
Q. What do you know about the conditions which prevailed there?
A. During the time of my internment I have heard that the inmates liked very much to work in these units. Whenever they entered bombed-out houses and cellars they found many objects which they could use very well. Otherwise, I don't know anything further about this matter.
Q. You have told us yesterday that on one occasion you accompanied Gluecks when he visited Camp Dora. Will you please give us a brief description just what brought about this Strip, and what you saw in the Camp Dora?
A Between Christmas and New Year's Day, 1943, this thing took place. At that period of time Dora was still an outside labor camp of Buchenwald. For reasons of security, it went under various names and designations. It was called "Nie."; that is an abbreviation of Niedersachswerffen. That is the locality where it was. It was also called K-Dorf,"and it was also called Dora and some other names. Guecks called my by phone one evening and he told me that on the following day he was going to visit Dora. He told, me he would meet Mauer and Pister. At that time Mauer took his Chrismas leave at Buchenwald where his family was also staying. He told me that if I had any mail for Maurer, I should go along the following day and submit this mail at Dora. On the following morning at 0700 we left Oranienburg. We arrived at Dora around noon time. We then went through the main shaft and I had the impression of being in a giant factory hall. Then I submitted the mail to Maurer which I had brought along with me and Gluecks in the meantime had a conference with the camp commanders and Pister, who was the commander of Buchenwald at that time. Then we again returned to Oranienburg. In this connection, I would like to say that the shafts and tunnels at that time looked quite dry. Already at that time production was going on there. That is to say, V-2 Weapons were being assembled there. I believe that this could have been impossible in a shaft which was not completely dry. The offices of the firms with their civilian employees were also located within the shafts and tunnels. Outside of the tunnels there was a big camp for the inmates which consisted of barracks. The director who was responsible for the production there was a certain Rickhei. At the same time he was in charge of a special field in the Speer Ministry. It came to my knowledge later on that Speer had told the commander of that camp that In recognition if the especially good work which had been done there and in acknowledgment of that work, he had given him and a four others special Christmas gifts.
In this connection, and in connection with the testimony of the various witnesses that have testified here about Dora, I would like to refer to Document III-336. That is Exhibit 379 in Document Book 13. It was presented by the prosecution temporarily.
Q On what page is this document located?
A It is Document 336 and it is on page 122 of the English Document Book. It is a report of the International Camp Committee and various detachments are mentioned and at various time intervals.
Q That is on page 111 of the English text.
A What I would like to discuss is found on page 122. It is stated here in all the statements that the death rate amounted to approximately 10%. The expert who compiled this document only failed to see in this case that in the statistics when you use columns you also must add up the counter figures in order to gain a real picture. In the case of Dora, he only adds the death rate and then he transfers that to the number of people who stayed at Dora in one month, and, of course, we have a false picture here; that is to say, we reach a mortality rate of 11.3%. If this had been figured out correctly, the death rate is a 12-month period should only amount to 2%.
Q In its opening speech, the prosecution in connection with Project S-III has made the following statement: "The Defendant Sommer himself went to Buchenwald in order to select inmates for this work." Is this statement of the prosecution correct?
A No.
Q During any of your interrogations or in any affidavit which you have given, did you ever make a statement to the effect which would support or justify this statement by the prosecution?
A No.
Q What do you know about S-III?
A The construction Project S-III was treated as a top secret matter. The documents about that were held in the safe of Maurer. I can recall that I heard of this project for the first time when Maurer one evening made several long distance calls with the Fuehrer Headquarters at Berchtesgaden. On that occasion he only told me that at the Troop Training Center at Ohrdruff a construction enterprise was to be carried out and that this Troop Training Center was to be evacuated for that purpose by the 10,000 soldiers who stayed there at that period of time.
I do not know who issued the individual orders for the Project S-III. I was only told that for reasons of secrecy once the project had begun no one could enter the Troop Training Center. I was also told that this camp was to be subordinated to the Camp Commander of Buchenwald and that he himself, however, would not be allowed to go there. He would not be authorized to send anybody there, in order to guarantee the security of the project. Therefore, everything which was necessary to maintain the camp with regard to the personnel would have to be sent to Ohrdruff and this personnel would have to remain at Ohrdruff until the construction enterprise had been completed. The concentration camp of Buchenwald was to furnish the necessary inmates for Project S-III. The order that no one was to be allowed to enter this training center, in my opinion, however, was very soon rescinded. The construction measures were carried out by Kammler's special staff.
Q Did you yourself have to go to Ohrdruff in official matters?
Q Yes.
Q What did you do at Ohrdruff?
A The Office Chief of D-IV, Sturmbannfuehrer Burger, at the end of the year, 1944, when the camp contained 500 inmates, that is to say, work had just begun there, was sent to Ohrdruff in order to settle the supply problem of the inmates. I received the order to go with Burger to Ohrdruff. in order to determine whether the labor assignment officer, who for the first time occupied an independent position, would be able to fulfill the requirements which were made of him; that is to say, whether he was a good administrator. If necessary, I was to provide him with the necessary information. That is why I went to Ohrdruff. I remained at Ohrdruff for approximately two hours and carried out my mission there.
Q Did you also make any suggestions to the other labor assignment officers before they began their work?
A No, this was an exceptional case, because of the special measures which had to be taken in the project.
Q In this connection did you also go to Buchenwald?
A Yes.
Q Please give the Tribunal a short description of just that brought about your visit at Buchenwald and what you observed there. Please give the Tribunal a short description of just what brought about your visit at Buchenwald and what you observed there. Please give us your opinion on the affidavit of Schwarz, Document NO-2125, Exhibit No. 299, which is located in Document Book XI. It is on page 30 of the German book, and on page 15 of the English text.
A On page 4 of this affidavit Schwarz states that I have visited Buchenwald at the end of 1944. The reason for this visit he alleges was to procure all workers for the construction of the secret fuehrer headquarters was to be established and constructed at Ohrdruff. My visit at Buchenwald happened quite by accident and it was not previously planned. We carried out the trip by means of a motor vehicle and because we did not have sufficient gasoline we had to use wood coal. As a result of this, the trip was very long and we would only be able to reach Berlin late at night and probably while an air raid was going on. Therefore, we decided to stay at Buchenwald over night. We arrived at Buchenwald around 2000 hours in the evening. On the following morning, at 0900 hours, I reported to the camp commander. I then requested him to call the labor allocation officer Schwartz there because I wanted to discuss labor allocations matters with him. I then looked at the statistics about labor assignment in the protective custody camp and the labor assignment leader, Schwarz, had it explained to me by an inmate just hour the classification officers tested the inmates with regard to their professional skills, that is to say, by using tools and materials which was located at the working statistical office. Afterwards we looked at the bomb damage and after dinner we returned to Berlin.
EXAMINATION BY THE PRESIDENT:
Q Witness, was the secret Fuehrer headquarters near Ohrdruff ever completed?
A No, your Honor, it was not. In any case I never hear that it been completed.
Q Was it begun? I mean was it started?
AAs far as I know, yes.
THE PRESIDENT: We'll take a recess.
THE MARSHAL: The Tribunal will recess for fifteen minutes.
(A recess was taken.)
THE MARSHAL: The Tribunal is again in session.
MR. ROBBINS: May it please the Tribunal, during the recess I conferred with the Secretary General and I think I can now clear up the confusion with regard to Documents No-1293 and No-1923. It is in Document Book IV. The original document which was included in Book IV when it was distributed is the correct document. It is No-1293, a letter from Gluecks dated 4 April 1944 and it has been offered in evidence as Prosecution Exhibit 99. At a subsequent time another document was distributed to be substituted for this document. However, that distribution was a mistake and the original book is correct. The other document, however, has been offered for identification. I put it to the defendant Frank on cross examination. It is NO-1923 and it has been offered in Document Book 22 for identification as Prosecution Exhibit 552. That is the letter which Judge Phillips was asking the defendant about. It is Glueck's letter dated 13 January 1944. So, both of the documents are before the Court. The defense counsel was correct.
JUDGE PHILLIPS: What was the page in Book 22?
MR. ROBBINS: It is on page 64, your Honor, it's the last document.
BY DR. BELZER:
Q. To continue with the direct examination, witness, who was it that ordered inmates to be transferred?
A. A Transfer of one inmate from one concentration camp to another were ordered by Gluecks in all cases. His deputies, Liebenhenschel and then Maurer until the end of 1943 were in a position to sign orders to transfer but Gluecks had to be conferred with at first. The order of the transfer was originally carried out by Office D-I, the central office, but when transfers were carried out difficulties arose because commandants would transfer ill inmates or clothe the inmates badly and things of that sort. Gluecks there-
upon ordered that in the actual order all these things should be mentioned so that they would reach the commandant as an official order. The draft of that order was made by office D-II and was approved by Gluecks. Then from that time onwards in my opinion all, at least, very many orders of transfer were drawn up by Office D-II but signed by Gluecks. These were the transfers from one camp to another whereas transfers from a concentration camp to a labor camp were up to the camp commandant without any specific order being necessary. The formal orders in writing very often were proceeded by teletype letters from Gluecks to the camp which then formed the basis of the actual order of transfer.
Q. Who was responsible for the carrying out of the orders of transfer?
A. The transfer order mentioned specifically that commandant of the camp from which the inmate was transferred, that camp which had to transfer inmates to other camps, was responsible that healthy and well nourished inmates would be transferred with sufficient food for the transport. Then it was also stated who supplied the guard personnel and transport leader who was responsible for the railroad transport. I know that there was an order once that the camp commandant and camp doctor were threatened, that they had to be responsible for the expenses which arose to the Reich if sick inmates were transferred from one camp to another and, therefore, were unable to work at their new camp. Later on, roughly in 1943 as I recall, a special form was drafted where both the commandant from which the transfer was carried out and the receiver camp had to confirm that the transport had been right and proper.
Q. Witness, please look in Document Book 21 at document NO2368, Exhibit 516, page 24 of the German and 25 of the English book. This is an affidavit by Entress. On page 3 of that affidavit at the bottom it says, and I quote: "Inmates were taken over by the head of the political department and the leader of the protective custody or his aid, a camp doctor and a labor assignment leader, carried out the actual selections."
This is the method of extermination in Auschwitz. On page 4 of the same affidavit in paragraph 16 it asserts and I quote: "All juveniles below the age of 16,all mothers accompanied by children, all ill and sick persons, were put on trucks and taken to the gas chambers. The balance of the inmates were taken over by the labor assignment leader and taken to the camp.
On page 6 of this affidavit, it says under paragraph 23: " The following departments of the camp Auschwitz knew of the gassings carried out and participated in them" I skip the next paragraph and continue with 'b': "The labor assignment leader knew about the gassings and participated as he was present when the inmates to be gassed were selected. He was under orders of office D-II." Now my question, witness, is--is it true that the labor allocation leader of Auschwitz camp or any other concentration camp was under orders of Office D-II?
A. No., the labor allocation leader of the concentration camp was the man who helped and assisted the camp commandant in matters of assignments. He received his orders entirely from him and was responsible only to the commandant in what he did.
THE PRESIDENT: Didn't Amt D-II have a representative in each concentration?
A. No, your Honor, the predecessor of D-II, Main Department I/5 had a representative in each camp. On 20 February 1942, this was discontinued and was never changed again.
BY DR. BELZER:
Q. Witness, is it not a fact that the correspondence and the exchange of documents between Office D-II and the Labor Allocation Leader was not carried out direct and immediate but went through the camp commandants?
A Yes, quite. The entire correspondence of D-II went to the camp commandant of the concentration camp, or, if it was a purely beaurocratic process, it was sent to the camp commandant's office of the concentration camp.
Q. And letters written by the Labor allocation Leader to D-II were signed-
A. They were signed by the Labor Allocation Leader on behalf of the camp commandant, which was printed on the form, or else by the commandant himself.
Q. To continue with respect to Entress's affidavit: Those inmates who were not to be gassed--was that part of the duty of the Labor Allocation Leader, in the concentration camp as far as you know?
A. Not that I know of. The camp commandant decided what the Labor Allocation Leader had to do and not D-II. He was to work on any question connected with the allocation of labor. In how far he was used by the camp commandant for other tasks, I am unable to say, It seems to me today that this would vary from camp to camp. Document NE 310 submitted by the Prosecution,Prosecution Exhibit 301 in Document Book II, is an affidavit by Kurt Pani. He talks about the formal process behind labor allocation, and he says, for instance that these orders about the detailing of detachments had been carried out by the commandant himself or the first officer in the protective custody cap. He goes on to say verbatim that in some cases the orders were also given by the Labor Allocation Leader. It is my impression, anyway, that it was not done in the same manner in all camps.
Q. Did Office D-II receive reports about the examinations in Auschwitz through the camp commandant or the labor allocation leader of concentration camp Auschwitz?
A. No.
Q. Was it possible to see from the surveys submitted to D-II anything about these exterminations--from the death rate reports, for instance?
A. No. As the affidavit shows, inmates about to be gassed were not first received into the concentration camp but were taken immediately from their railway wagons to the gas chambers. Therefore they could not appear in the lists as new arrivals or as departed inmates. Hoess also said in his affidavit that he never did keep figures about the gassings.
Q. Witness, in your testimony up to now you have said that you had no official or unofficial observations concerning the examination of certain groups of inmates such as Jews, Gypsies, and so forth. I would like to ask you whether you limit that testimony to persons who appeared on the lists of concentration camps?
A. Yes.
Q. When you commenced on the affidavit of Entress just now, you said that you as an expert in inmate labor allocation, were not in a position to hear anything about the extermination,of special groups of persons because they had not been first received into the various camps. My question is: Did you hear anything about that in any other way at any time?
A. Yes. Antsgruppe Chief Gluecks told me.
Q. Please describe to the Court in the greatest detail on what occasion this happened and what it was that Gluecks told you about.
A. The former commandant of Auschwitz camp in December 1943 or January 1944 was Chief of Office D-I, the central office of Amtsgruppe D. In April of 1944, approximately, it became known that some hundreds of thousands of Jews would arrive from Hungary soon, and we were told that these were Jews who belonged to construction details behind the front line in Hungary and that they represented a danger to the army.
These workers were to be used for work as quickly as possible, and, as it was explained to me at the time, Hoess was sent to Auschwitz because he had connections with the Reich railways and other departments, and it was only through him that it became possible for transportation to become available as quickly as possible in order to transport these workers to wherever they were to work.
One evening about the end of May or the beginning of June 1944 I was called in to see Gluecks. He told me roughly this: " I want you to swear under oath that you will not say one word about what I am about to tell you to anybody. Otherwise, you will lose your life. You know that Jews are about to come from Hungary. By Hitler's orders, some of them have to be killed. Hoess has gone to Auschwitz for that purpose. Every evening he sends me a teletype letter as top secret containing the figures of the Jews who have arrived and have been killed. I shall see to it that these teletype letters will be sent to you so that you can keep a register, because you work every evening late after hours."
When he told me this, I was appalled. I deliberated for a moment, and then I asked him not to give me that order because I was overworked to such an extent that I could not possible take on any additional work. Gluecks was slightly taken aback at this and then told me, "All right, I'll pick out somebody else."
That is how I heard about the extermination of the Jews in Auschwitz.
Q. To clarify this, you therefore were not given the order that Gluecks meant you to have?
A. No.
Q. Why did Gluecks pick you out, of all people?
A. I described before that I used to work every evening until eight or nine o'clock. Everybody else went home at six or seven, whereas we were the only persons to work overtime. I had to assume that this was the reason why Gluecks wanted me to work on this measure--so that these teletype letters, when they reached us, would immediately be looked up in a safe and would not be left lying about In the teletype office.
Q. The reason why you were to be given that assignment was, as you are bound to assume, not that the task which you were meant to do was connected in any way with the field of tasks of D-II and your own matters?
A. No, in no sense of the word.
Q. And this work which Gluecks meant you to do, you, in order to prevent doing this, pretended to be overworked? Was that your real reason?
A. I could pretend to be overworked, and Gluecks had to believe me. Actually, it would not have been too much work if I had carried out this order, but I did not wish to be connected with these things-which is the reason I refused.
THE PRESIDENT: What was the date of this conversation with Gluecks?
A. It must have been in May or June of 1944, Your Honor.
Q. Don't you think that Gluecks really guessed what your real motive was?
A. I think so. I concluded that because, roughly in October of 1944, Gluecks told me that by Himmler's order, the extermination of the Jews in Auschwitz had been discontinued. I was of the opinion at the time that the whole matter was begun only in 1944 and that it had been concluded very soon or at least been discontinued quickly because one had realized the insanity of this measure.
Q. If I understand you correctly, you refused this cold blooded murder Gluecks told you about because it was a crime. Would you have had the authority to prevent this crime being committed?
A. No.
Q. But, in your opinion, at least at the time, was it not possible for you to exercise some influence, at least regarding the extent of this planned extermination? What did you do?
On the day when Gluecks gave me this frightful information Maurer went away on an official trip. He returned the following morning. I immediately reported to him and told him what Maurer had told me and I asked him what he knew about this.
THE PRESIDENT: Only what Gluecks had told him.
THE INTERPRETER: I know, sir, but he said Maurer, unfortunately.
THE WITNESS: Yes, Your Honor. Maurer told me that he himself had heard of these things only in connection with Hoess's departure from Oranienburg to Auschwitz. He told me that it was necessary for us to find as many possibilities of labor allocation as possible and send at least a daily teletype letter to Auschwitz when these plants called for labor, in order to get transports of inmates from Auschwitz into the Reich. He thought that thereby he could sabotage the whole measure. He, himself, was not allowed to interfere with these things, which anyway had nothing to do with the WVHA. He wrote to all sorts of agencies, firms and governmental departments. He rang them up. We made an arrangement with Speer's ministry whereby this ministry would immediately supply us with any labor that was requested. That arrangement came about although Pohl, two years before, had refused to call in Speer or the Plenipotentiary for Labor Allocation in questions pertaining to the labor allocation of inmates.
Maurer did without the somewhat exaggerated security measures for all these camps. The barbed wire, for instance, had to be electrically charged all the time. I recall also in this connection a silent but tough struggle where we emerged victorious in the end. The firm Siemens, which had a branch in Thuringia, was promised female labor by us. Gauleiter Sauckel, who was also Plenipotentiary for Labor Allocation, had forbidden Siemens to take over these inmates. He told them that he could not expect his fellow Thuringians to work under the same roof as Jewish laborers, and he had therefore ordered that women, who were conscripted, should be transferred from Berlin to Thuringia. These conscripted women never reached Thuringia. Neither Siemens nor other firms in the Thuringian area employed female labor, and these firms thereupon simply explained that these women were of foreign extraction.