instructing the DAF in any way in connection with the war of aggression. caring of foreign workers? as 1939 voluntarily took over the care of foreign workers. those foreign workers who camt to Germany during the war and particularly those who came compulsorily. care of all foreign workers.
Q What was the task of the DAF? Ported the work of the factory managers who, according to law, had to care for their workers. Furthermore, through its own measures, tried to lighten the task of the factory manager.
Q Did the Labor Front fulfill this duty? difficult, especially in those districts which were the targets of enemy bombers but I can explain that the German Labor Front did everything humanly possible to care for those workers. raids on the Rhur, you mere employed there, especially by the Labor Front, in order to carry out the difficult special-care measures; is that correct? the Ruhr myself so that in spite of the air raids, the production of industrial workers would be maintained for this is purpose--I was to support the competent local agencies. Krupp firm in Essen?
Krupp's but I can give information about the essential things since, I, myself, visited the Krupp concerns in part two or three times during this period. the whole?
A. On the whole, there were two things that had to be taken care of, food and lodging of the workers; since Krupp as well as the City of Essen were repeatedly attacked by bombers with serious damage, this concern was working under extraordinaril difficult conditions. It was often necessary through institutions beyond the concern; that is, the DAF, the Provisional Economic Office and such, to help the concerns.
Q A report of Dr. Jaeger was shown you in the Commission a document D-288, and mistreatment of workers is indicated there. Does this report correspond to the facts as you found them? extent this report of Dr. Jaeger corresponda to the facts. On the basis of my own experience, however I had the impression that in many points things were presented with some exaggeration certainly by Dr. Jaeger, with the good intention of influencing the agencies which were to help him. I recall that Dr. Jaeger once said that the foreign workers received only a thousand calories. I can say one thing. Even during the war in Germany, even for normal consumers there was no ration of only a thousand calories a day.
Q Can the conditions which Dr. Jaeger describes of a few camps be extended to all the camps of the Krupp firm?
A Dr. Jaeger, as far as I recall, describes two camps and describes only individual occurances in those camps. Conditions were difficult at Krupp's. These cases cannot be applies to all camps. If Dr. Jaeger points out that in one barracks in prticular it rained in for weeks, I can only say that in the City of Essen it rained for weeks and into thousands of houses and the people were happy there; people were lucky who had any shelter at all even if the rein bothered them a little.
regarding the treatment of the workers at Krupp's. Do these give an approximate picture of conditions throughout the Reich?
A I have the following to say to that. In the Reich we had tens of thousands of medium-sized and large concerns. The conditions found in Essen, even if they are true, cannot be considered in general as a norm for the treatment of foreign workers in Germany.
Q. Were security measures taken so that no unsuitable elements would be cared for by the German Labor Front?
A. The German Labor Front from the Reich level as well as the Gau level and in the Kreis level, had an office that was the Office Labor Commitment which dealt exclusively with these questions of foreigners. All orders direct to the agencies and to the concerns by this office repeatedly deal in some form with the necessity for correct and just treatment for reasons of humanity as well as for reasons of production. I would like to add something. To prevent men who had in any wasy misused their powers, who should not come into contact any more with the foreign workers, this Office Labor Commitment had a so-called card index of the camp, to warn camp leaders, which were issued to the Kreises and Gaus. This list contained the names of all men who had misused their powers. It also listed the punishment which they had received for doing so and it said that they were no longer to be used as camp leaders.
Q. And were orders issued, ordering correct treatment and, for example, prohibiting punishment by beating? Does this not show that such orders were necessary and mistreatments general?
A. In every organization there are social elements. I do not deny that here and there a functionary of the German Labor Front misused his powers. This fact was the occasion for such an order. On the other hand, this order is to be considered a collection of all the many decrees which had been issued up to that time. One can say the following about that: In every cultured state there are laws prohibiting murder, robbery and so forth.
THE PRESIDENT: Is it necessary to go into all these details?
DR. SERVATIUS: Mr. President, it is only because this question was repeatedly asked the witness in the Commission. That is why I wanted to present it to the Court once. I do not see what great interest the prosecution has in this question but it repeated it many times. Then I shall go on to the next question.
BY DR. SERVATIUS:
Q. What happened to the guards supervising and executing the orders about social care?
A. Aside from the Office Labor Commitment which was responsible for the care of these workers, which I have already mentioned, D.r Ley, within the German Labor Front, set up a so-called camp inspectorate which was under the direction of a DAF functionary and had the task outside the jurisdiction of the Labor Commitment Office to inspect the camps of foreigners and to maintain order if there was any disorder. This arrangement served the tactic purpose of preventing other organs aside from the DAF in dealing with this question.
Q. Were you yourself able to observe anything about the inhumane treatment of workers, or were any such mistreatments reported to you? You travelled, around to the different places. What was your total impression?
A. These things were not reported directly to me since I was not the competent office chief for these matters, but as deputy for the German factori I was in hundreds of factories and camps. I must say that aside from individual cases, things were in order there.
Dr. SERVATIUS: Mr. President, I have no more questions to put to this witness and I have examined all my witnesses.
THE PRESIDENT: The Tribunal will adjourn.
(A recess was taken) BY LT. COL. GRIFFITH JONES:
Q. Witness, I want to ask you one question on the expert staff Officers of the Gau, Kreis, and Ortsgruppenleiters. Do they come under their respective Hoheitstraegers on the matters of discipline? Did you hear that question?
A. Yes, I did. Each of the functionaries of the German Labor Front had to obey the orders of his immediate superior as well as discipline. I personally was out side the DAF. I was subordinate to the leader of the German Labor Front. He was the only one who could call me in the office or remove me from office.
Q. The expert, for instance the DAF representative, on the Gau Staff, received his professional technical instructions from his DAF superior, is that correct? Is it not?
A. I personally, as well as the others, received the directions and instructions from the superiors.
Q. I am sure you can answer my question yes or no. The point I am putting is this. Although you received your professional or expert instruction from your DAF superior, you were also subordinate, were you not, to the Hoheitstraeger of your staff in all matters on discipline and matters connected with the party?
A. If anyone was a political leader, he of course was subordinate to the party discipline, and he only concerned himself with those things which belonged to his sphere of activity.
Q. One question about the political leaders of the DAF. A political leader in the DAF, was he sworn in as a political leader in the same way as any other political leader was sworn in?
A. A political leader of the DAF took his oath to the Fuehrer.
Q. Did he also receive a special certificate or identity card which was issued to all other political leaders?
A. Yes, he did, he received a certificate stating his rank.
LT. COL. GRIFFITH JONES: This witness was cross-examined before the commission, and I would like to draw the Tribunal's attention to one new document which was not put to him, and two others which deal with the DAF particularly. The first one is a new document, D-338, which will be handed up to the Tribunal. It is a report of the conditions in the sick bay hut in one of the Krupp Camps. My purpose in putting it in is that it is addressed to the KVD and the Gauamstsleiter Doctor Heinz.
Q. Witness, is the KVD the association of Doctors and Physicians?
A. That is an Association of physicians - a panel - but the organization for the physicians was the Aerstebund League of Physicians.
Q. It is an association of doctors. Is theGauamstsleiter, Doctor Heinz, would you presume from that document, that he was an expert nonpolitical political leiter on the Gau staff concerned with medical matters?
A. The position that he held is not noted here, but I assume it was the some person, yes.
LT. COL. GRIFFITH_JONES: My Lord, the Tribunal will find --
THE PRESIDENT: What is the number?
LT. COL GRIFFITH JONES: I beg your pardon - GB-547. The next document will be found on page 19 of the Tribunal document book. It is a document which has been put in and I am not certain whether or not it was read to the Tribunal, and I would particularly refer to the penultimate paragraph on the first page which is of considerable importance in connection with the DAF.
It is a report by one of the Krupp officers. It is an original German document and it refers to a discussion which that gentleman had with three members of the DAF in connection with the food which he was trying to get for the starving Russian Prisoners of War and Russian laborers.
but perhpas I may be allowed to read the one paragraph describing that point
THE PRESIDENT: The Document has been read.
LT COL GRIFFITH JONES: I would like to draw the attention of the Tribunal to the decree for Ensuring the Discipline and Output of Foreign workers, which had been passed by the DAF, it will be found on pages nine and ten - Document D-226 -US 697, perhaps I might ask the witness one question on this. BY LT COL GRIFFITH JONES:
Q. Witness, will you look at that document and the covering letter, which is dated November 10, 1944. Is this letter signed by yourself ?
A. Yes.
Q. On page 10, it will be seen that it is a covering letter, enclosing a decree on the employment of foreign labor, in which it says :"It is of particular importance that not only the present good out put should be secured, but also that further working reserves should be freed, which, without doubt, can still be obtained from these millions of foreign workers.
It then goes on to say in paragraph 2 :"All men and women of the NSDAP, its subsidiaries and affiliated bodies in the works, will, in accordance with instructions from the Kreisleiters be warned by their Ortsgruppen leaders, and be put under obligation." the Party, the State and Industry, with departments of the Secret Police is absolutely necessary for this purpose.
I now read the last three lines of paragraph 2-b :"Party members, both men and women, and members of Party organization and affiliated bodies must be expected more than ever before, to conduct themselves in an examplary manner."
At the bottom of the page will be seen :"The Gau Trustee of the DAF will issue detailed instructions in cooperation with the Gau Propaganda leader an the lader of the Gau department for Social Questions." of cooperation between the political leaders, the Kreisleiters and the Gestapo.
THE PRESIDENT: If there are who further questions, the witness may retire.
Dr. Servatius, you may make such comments as you wish on your documents
DR. SERVATIUS: Mr. President, I do not have the documents at hand and they have not been translated; therefore, they cannot be presented to the Tribunal. I would suggest that first of all the witnesses be examined and then the Documents will be ready and I will submit them at that time.
THE PRESIDENT: We have the books ourselves.
DR. SERVATIUS: It is not only the Document books that we are concerned with, but the affidavits are not at hand. I do not have them myself and they have not been translated. That is the way I interpreted the decision and I shall take care of the matter in the morning.
THE PRESIDENT: Would it be convenient to submit some of these documents in these two document books now and leave the affidavits until later on ?
DR. SERVATIUS: I do not have the affidavits with me and I have not prepared myself on this matter. It would not be an orderly presentation and I should prefer to submit them some other time.
THE PRESIDENT: Then, the Tribunal will go on to the evidence for the next organization.
DR. SERVATIUS: Mr. President, when shall I sumbit this matter ? After the evidence for the next organization, or after all witnesses have been heard ?
THE PRESIDENT: After the next one, I should tink.
DR. SERVATIUS: Very well.
THE PRESIDENT: What is the next organization we will deal with ?
DR. MERKEL: On behalf of the Secret State Police - the Gestapo.
Mr. President, may it please the Tribunal, first of all I should like to submit my two document books, one containing numbers one to thirty and the other containing thirty one to sixty two.
Mr. President, shall I confine my point of view to the individual documents now or after the witness is heard ?
THE PRESIDENT: When it is convenient to you.
DR. MERKEL: I should prefer to do it after the witness has been heard.
THE PRESIDENT: Very well.
DR. MERKEL: First of all, I would like to submit a list of the thirteen witnesses, who have been heard before the Commission. Furthermore, I should like to submit a German copy of the thirteen transcripts. I should like to submit this material as evidence and the arguments, which I will present myself, in connection with the examination of the witness. of the affidavits, given in the Commission, numbered one to eighty five, which I should like to offer in evidence. I shall submit as soon as I have them. I would like to submit in one summarizing affidavit, but that summary has not yet been completed. For this reason, I should like to ask that I be permitted to submit this after the witness has been heard. witness, Dr. Best.
THE PRESIDENT: Bring on the witness.
DR. KARL RUDOLF WERNER BEST, a witness, took the stand and testified as follows : BY THE PRESIDENT:
Q. Will you state your full name ?
A. Dr. Karl Rudolf Werner Best.
Q. Will you repeat this oath after me ? I swear by God, the Almighty and Omniscient, that I will speak the pure truth and will withhold nothing.
(The witness repeated the oath.)
BY DR. MERKEL:
Q Mr. Witness, please tell us briefly your professional autobiography.
A I am a jurist and a professional civil servant. Beginning with 1929 I was a judge, and since 1933 I have been an administrative official, and since 1942 I have been a diplomat.
Q When and how did you join the Gestapo? administration and law, I was active in the Gestapo in Berlin. Beginning with 1936 in the Reich Ministry for the Interior and in the Special Department of the Security Police, up until 1940. Beginning with 1940 and until 1942 I was the administrative official, and since 1942 I have been Reich Plenipotentiary in Denmark.
Q Was the Gestapo a union of people?
Q What was the Gestapo? of people joined together voluntarily in order to realize certain aims.
AAn organization has members. The official of the Secret State Police were officials hired by the state, and they occupied a public position. An organization sets its own aims, but the offices of the Secret State Police received their tasks from the state and from the state leadership, which put to them. Socialist organization? state ofices.
Q Witness, please speak a little more slowly. Otherwise, the interpreters can not keep up.
German territory?
A No. In the various states political police systems arose which the state government concerned set up.
Q Were these offices completely new? Were they a novel idea? existed through re-organization.
Q In what way did this take place? state governments? a state police system was created. The authority of the police had been shaken by the incidents that took place before 1933, and a new form of politic police was to be strengthened, and especially as it applied to members of the National Socialist movement. I assume that this reason existed and played a part in other German states as well.
Q Did these new agencies receive new tasks?
A No. No, they received the same tasks which the political police had had in the past,
Q What tasks were they? Can you enumerate them? there was a political motive, and on the other hand, the police prevention of such acts and deeds.
Q What do you mean by "preventive measures" by the police? perpetrators or to groups of perpetrators with the view that these groups or individuals concerned would not undertake criminal actions. Go man state. -- Polizeikommandeur? about an agreement with the governments of the various German states on his position as Polizeikommandeur of each individual state in Germany.
Q Did Himmler come from the police or from the police system as such?
political training of thoughts and methods of work was concerned, he never quite worked his way into that. responsible for Hitler's coming to power? accompli. states unified into a uniform German Secret State Police? the Reich Ministry of the Interior. That was in the year 1936. By several directives and decrees issued by the Reich Ministry of the Interior, the political police systems of the various German states were unified in a uniform Secret State Police. police, or was this ever done? by the state as a political police system? by Party members in the year 1933? remained, and only a few officials were taken on new at that time.
Q Were the leading officials members of the Party? Were they Party people?
A That varied in the various states. In part there were officials who had belonged to entirely different parties.
Q Can you give us an example along this line?
A There are several well known examples. It is well known that Mr. Diehls, the leader of the Prussian Socket State Police, had had different political beliefs in the past.
together with him were taken to Berlin -- such as Mueller, the later head of Amt IV; Huber, Fresch, Beck -- all of those men in the past had been follower of the Bavarian Peoples' Party, and the leader of my small Hessen police office was a former Democrat and Freemason. He was a man whom I considered suitable and proper for this post. National Socialist rule? the state, even though the government was changed. -- to serve the state as long as he is in a position to do so. later on? in the years that followed? offices of the Political Police, and they were transferred to these offices. In the meantime new candidates came in and were trained to be officials according to these rules that applied.
Q Were people taken over from the Party, from the SS, and the SA? agencies paid very little in wages and therefore it was not desirable.
Q Did the officials volunteer to enter the political Police? to office.
Q Did the officials have to comply with these transfers?
Q What would have been the consequence if they had refused? dismissed from office, and they would have lost their seniority rights and their rights to a pension.
Q Do you know of any such refusal?
administrative set-up of the state? police agencies, with the political experts of the government; inspectors of the security police were personally responsible to the presidents of the states and had to comply with their directives. political activity in the political police system? exercised it.
Q In what way? gendarmerie, and the administrative systems, either on the basis of announcements that came in to them were activated that way, or they carried out the orders of the competent state police.
Q What part in the entire political police system did the Kreis and Orts police agencies have?
systems did the major part, of the state police cases and dealt with them. The state police offices sent out their men in special cases such as cases of treason and high treason. that went out from the secret police?
A Yes, they received these decrees and directives if it wasn't prohibited in special cases on specialrequest. prosecute certain crimes? from private persons or other agencies outside of the police, reports which were addressed to them.
Q And in what lines did this apply? political police. The police, therefore, were not in a position to investigate these cases and to check whether they actually existed, and a message service was organized where groups were suspected of activities such as the illegal Communist party or in cases of espionage. In cases like that, through agents of through similar means they tried to find these groups and to clarify the matters. other measures against people come about for political statements which they had made? the Gestapo was a not of spies and information agencies which kept track of the entire people. With a few officials who were always busy, anything like that could not be carried on. Such single reports dealing with unsuitable political statements come to the police. Reports like that were not locked for, were not sought after, for with 90% of the cases you couldn't do anything to start with, anyway.
Q Please speak a little slower. Was there a special class of Gestapo officials which differentiated itself completely from the other classes of Gestapo officials?
A No. The officials of the secret police belonged to the same categories as the corresponding officials of other police systems.
Q What categories of officials were there in the Gestapo? administrative officials and executive officials.
Q How did these branches differ? status, and through their training.
Q To what extent did the legal status differ? service laws. But for executive officials there was a special branch in the police law books.
Q How did they differ in training? as higher or lower or medium administrative officials, according to the procedure set up in the internal administrative agencies -- that is, the police praesidium, and so forth. The executive officials, however, were trained in the so-called "Fuehrerschule", of the security police and in the agencies of the secret state police and the criminal police.
Q Which tasks did the administrative officials in the Gestapo have? all other police agencies. That is, dealing with personnel records, with internal matters, and economic tasks, and on the other hand, the dealing with substantive laws such as passport laws or the laws dealing with foreigners. officials?
A No. If there wasn't an administrative official to keep track of and look after them, and if he wasn't designated to do that, as far as carrying out of sentences, they had no connection with that. tasks?
A No. That was almost impossible, for each official was obligated to keep the matters that he concerned himself with secret, which was a customs maxim of the police, that one did not discuss the individual cases that were before one.
Q Did the administrative officials join the Gestapo voluntarily?
A No. Administrative officials were transferred from the other internal administrative or from other police agencies. activities?
A No. Each carried out his tasks to which he had been assigned.
Q That departments were there? border police, later the defensive part of the military Abwe hr, and the border members were incorporated into the Gestapo so that they became part of it later on. Gestapo after 1933 for the first time?
A No. Even before 1933 they existed. They were carried out by the same officials who were later on taken over into the Gestapo, and the officials who had beenactive in the so-called Central police agencies.
Q You mentioned the Abwehr police as a part of the Gestapo. That were the tasks of the Abwehr police? without exception, were given over to the courts for sentencing
Q And you mentioned the border police, also. That were its tasks? They checked the so-called small border traffic. They gave legal assistance to neighboring foreign police, supervised the deporting of people, the combatting of narcoti cs, international narcotic traffic, and prosecuted criminals at the border. which was a part of the Gestapo?
A As I have already said, the defensive part of the military counter-
intelligence which was assigned to the Gestapo during the war had the task of checking and clarifying the intelligence systems which were applied agains Germany and making them harmless through their work.
Q A further part of the Gestapo was the so-called "Zollgrenzschutz" (Border and Custom Protection). What were its tasks? and incorporated into the Gestapo, had the task of watching the so-called "green border", that is, beyond the border, and those border towns and passes where no border police was stationed. In cases like that it carried out the tasks of the border police.