Q. Witness, before you went to the SS Main Operational Office, did you inform yourself as to the wishes of the various office groups, and what did they tell you?
A. It is a general usage that when you go to a new department you introduce yourself to all the office group chiefs, which of course, I did. I should add here that Office Group C, which was one of the office groups connected with the Building Inspection in the Inspection Building Management all over Germany, and also had agencies abroad, had a large number of vehicles at their disposal. The position was not that these vehicles were belonged to or were under the orders of the WVHA, but the position rather was that when a Building Management received the order to build something, they contacted a building firm, and used their entire vehicles, including their technical equipment, which they hired from them, and the conditions were such that the firms which were evacuated to Russia, for instance, used only old vehicles. Those vehicles were transferred in Russia, and were put on the bill of the Waffen-SS as a new item. On the other hand, vehicles which were never used at all but which cost about fifty or one-hundred marks, they were the highest quality, were left standing for months without being used at all. The WaffenSS paid the whole bill in this case as well. Having found out these things, and that no officer was interested in this, I asked to be allowed to find out these things. I have to say that I regarded it as my most important task to bring this to order.
Q. What about the other office groups?
A. Office Group A-- The position was that they had a few passenger cars, PKW's, which were concentrated in the motor pool of Office Group B. In Office Group B the main troop depots, the clothing works and clothing depots had been supplied with vehicles by the Main Operational Office. From an administrative point of view they were under the Motor Pool, Berlin, Office Group B, Berlin.
Office Group D handled matters in the following manner: I reported to Gluecks in Oranienburg, and I was not too pleasantly received. I shall attempt to describe this as literally as possible. I should like to remark that on the basis of my military training, which I had for ten years before I joined the WYHA, a general to me was a general. Gluecks said roughly this, "You are the one we have been waiting for." I must say that we call this extremely bad manners if you are being attacked in this manner once you appear on the scene. He said to me also, "You can't help me as far as your workshops are concerned. As far as my vehicles are concerned they are in better shape than you can ever hope to achieve. The Death Head Units under Gruppenfuehrer Eicke have helped me there. I have my own technical management. I have my own technical officers, and I really have no use for you at all."
I cleared this up in the following manner with him? For the sake of the Main Operational Office, he should report to me monthly. That is to say, reports should be made out on the printed forms. I must say that I did not bother about Gluecks anymore.
Q. Witness, just now you spoke about an order which you worked out with other members of the Main Operational Office and which, as it were, formed the basis of that office. Can you tell the Tribunal roughly what the order said?
A. The order said roughly this: All reports about vehicles or reports about the fuels used, the tires needed, spare parts needed, all requirements for arms and equipment, and all requirements for rail transports have to be reported to B-V of the WVHA.
It also said that these reports had to be passed on to the Army.
May I give a brief explanation of why this was necessary? Fuel, for instance. The position was that because of the shortage of fuel in Germany, certain rations on the basis of 100 kilometers per vehicle had been worked out. A certain quantity of fuel was allowed. Therefore, if all reports from the agencies reached B-V in the WVHA, they contained all vehicles on printed forms, and it was laid down precisely how the vehicles had to be described. Vehicles being repaired and also vehicles not being used for a time were not included in the reports.
On the basis of those reports, the fuel was calculated by the Main Operational Office for the whole of the WVHA. The Main Operational Office passed it on to B-V, and B-V would pass it on to the agencies concerned. That also applies for all other parts. This is what the order said in its essence: That things should be concentrated there.
Q. Witness, now I would like to forget about vehicles from this order, and I would like to ask you the following question: Were you concerned with the actual use of the vehicles or were you concerned only with the maintenance of vehicles? What was the extent reached by your work? Did it concern the entire Waffen-SS or only the agencies of the WVHA? Will you please describe that?
A. It did not concern the Waffen-SS. As I said before, the whole of the Waffen-SS was looked after by Office X of the Main Operational Office.
On the chart, under B-V, we have the translation "Transportation". Under "transportation" we understand the following in Germany: a concentrated motor pool from which an agency like the WVHA can be supplied.
That is not the case here. If we speak of Office B-V, we must not call it "Transportation", but a purely administrative agency which has nothing to do with actual transports as such.
These transport columns, these large convoys we had, of course but only with the army. Army groups and similar units had these large transport columns, and they had agencies where-in they sent these vehicles onto trailroad tracks which had been damaged. They transported thousands of tons of fuel or ammunition to the front or transferred troops, or performed tasks of a similar nature. These transport columns did not exist in the Waffen-SS. All I can say is that all reports and vehicle requirements of the WVHA were concentrated in B-V and were passed on in a report to Office X of the Main Operational Office.
Q. Witness, according to what directive did you work, and can one see from those directives what sort of work you did?
A. Yes, roughly speaking, you can. The position is that I saw here in the library of the Courthouse a few of my former orders. The position is that had I made extracts of all my orders, I could have filled the whole document book. I took out only a few documents, and I would like to describe, on the basis of those documents, how my work was done.
Q. If the Court please, first of all, I would like to ask the witness the following question: You told us that you found a few of your orders here. That means that these were orders which you had given yourself? Is that correct?
A. No, no. The position is that these are orders which applied to the whole of the army and the Waffen-SS. Whether they show my initials or the initials of somebody else does not matter. We worked according to those orders.
Q. If the Tribunal please, I would now like to ask the witness a few questions on the basis of my document book. For that purpose, I submit from Document Book Scheide No. I, Document No. 2, which will become Exhibit I. It is on Page 3 of the English Document book.
Witness, what does this document show us, this extract from the official Gazette of the Waffen-SS of 1941, Page 10?
A. Paragraph 23 of that Gazette shows reports on stocks of motor vehicles with the units and offices of the Waffen-SS. I do not want to read the whole thing. In the second paragraph it says: "The designations of motor vehicles can be obtained from the Regulations No. 600. The standard names for motor vehicles are laid down in the Army Bulletin, Page 37, figure 1450." The Army Bulletin is the paper on which we worked and through which the orders of the Main Operational Office reached us.
Under (2): "It is therefore ordered that the stock of vehicles of all units of the Waffen-SS (with the exception of the units under the control of the Army)---" and I may add that these are the units which were standing at the front--"has to be reported again by 15 November 1941 on the prescribed form."
Paragraph 3, it is the responsibility of the commanding officer to see that the reports submitted are complete.
Q. Witness, I would like to ask you this about that document. You received this document from the Main Operational Office, did you?
A. Yes.
Q. What did you do with it? Did you have it mimeographed; did you change it?
A. If it was clear and understandable, even for a small official who was working somewhere in the agency, it was passed on in the original. If it was not so clear and intelligible it was changed so that even the most simple-minded person could understand it.
Q. Witness, then I shall submit Schiede Document No. 3 which shall become Exhibit No. 2. It is on Page 4 of the English document book. Will you please give us your comments on that document? What does the document show about your ministry activity?
A. I want to say only very briefly that under "18: References," that means that the agency chief, or the transport officer, has to make reference to the Army Gazette of this or that number, and he has to work accordingly.
Q. Then can you recall this document or give us your opinion about it? Did it go on as a copy, or did you issue any special directives or orders?
A. Certain matters are involved here which are of no use to the home agencies. For instance, 38-ton armored vehicles they don't use in the homeland. That, of course, is obvious. That did not concern the men at home. These documents were passed on in the original. Very possibly we gave an addition or a supplementary document where I expressed my personal opinion.
Q. In what capacity did you do that, as a transport officer, or what?
A. Yes, as the transport officer of the WVHA.
Q. Then I shall submit Document Scheide No. 4, which will be Exhibit No. 3. Will you please give us your comments briefly on that document?
A. Here again it becomes quite clear that we worked according to the orders of the army. Under Figure 24, "Issue of permanent trip tickets," and Figure 25, "Refueling of motor vehicles," the fuel position becomes clear from this sentence, in the second sentence: "The present fuel position is such that each official post or unit has only enough fuel to carry out its official operations."
In the next paragraph, 26, reference is made to Page 18 of the Army Gazette, Part C, Figures 42 to 45.
Q. Then I shall submit Document Scheide No. 5, which shall become Exhibit No. 4. It is on Page 8 of the English document book. Witness, gain let us have your comments, particularly about Figure 20, "Wood-gas generators". Did you have anything to do with that affair?
A. The difficulties at the front, above all where fuel was concerned, that is to say, our fuel factories were very frequently destroyed. We were, therefore compelled to have the entire transport adjusted to wood gas, which means that, to speak very crudely, we drove with real ovens at the back of our cars. The difficulties were to convince the whole of the driver personnel and the technical personnel that we had no fuel at home, no gas, no Diesel oil. If I have a car, I have it fueled and go away, but when I have a wood-gas generator, I have to get up an hour and a half earlier, and if I am lucky I finally take off after an hour and a half. As this was the case with all vehicles at home, and wood could not be obtained in sufficient quantities, administrative orders were issued that each man had to be completely restrained, and the effect of this was that the vehicle situation in Germany conked out at home and we had to withdraw gasoline from the front because otherwise the supply for the homeland would have become endangered.
These are things which might be described quite easily today, but at that time that was an extreme difficulty.
JUDGE PHILLIPS: Just a minute, Doctor. Just as a matter of information, how efficient were the wood-burners in comparison with the gas-propelled motors?
THE WITNESS: Your Honor, I think the comparison is about fifty percent. The efficiency is fifty percent less. We had the advantage at the time that we had our autobahn, our motor road. If I was driving at a certain speed, I noticed I could keep good time on the autobahn, but no mountains or hills must occur, because once you drive up a mountain you lose yet more. Then we made all sorts of other experiments. We used coal, for instance, or wood and coal. We used lignite. We tried everything in order to be really successful, but there is only one good generator, which is the Kristen generator, a Swedish invention, which proved its worth. All others did not prove successful because the ovens were too heavy; the weight of the car became too big.
Q. (By Dr. Hoffmann) Witness, I shall now submit Document Scheide No. 6 which will become Exhibit No. 5. From that document I would like to draw the Court's attention to the last paragraph where it says, on Page 10 of the English document book, "Motor Accidents in units or official posts of the Waffen-SS" and "For Motor accidents of vehicles, which belong to the Office Group D (Management and administration of concentration camps) of the SS Economic and Administrative Main Office, the same authorities will be competent and the same procedure will be followed as up to now." This makes clear that Office Group D, as far as vehicles were concerned, was given a special position, is that correct, Witness?
A. I must say that I did not know this order in the old days for the simple reason that the transport officers of Office Group D were not in my charge. But I see from this order that on accidents which occurred to Office Group D I explain in the following manner:
If inmates were being driven to their labor allocation on a vehicle, and should an accident occur where an inmate would be injured, what they probably did was say that the inmate was the subject of other supply orders than say the driver or the mate, who were members of the Waffen-SS. I know today that the whole accident regulations were looked after by the head of the legal department of Office Group D himself. All accidents which occurred to the Waffen-SS were handled by us and handed over to an SS-court. To give one example, in peacetime, for instance, for the Leibstandarte, "Adolf Hitler" I worked on all the accidents myself, and as the transport officer I represented our side before the court. In wartime this was changed because there we were subject to the army orders. With all these normal orders the Office Group D forms an exception.
Q. And your explanation is because the insurance policies were different in the case of inmates and the drivers?
A. Yes.
Q. Then I shall submit Document No. 7 which will become Exhibit No. 6. Witness, will you give your comments on that document, please?
A. On the basis of this document it becomes clear that on 15 May 1944 the converting operation under the password "Gengas", which was the important order, conversion to wood gas - "Gengas" means generator gas, which is the same as wood gas - the monthly reports are no longer being sent to the Main Operational Office as it was done before, but they now reach the army direct, the Army District Command.
Q. Then I shall submit Document No. 8 which will become Exhibit No. 7 on Page 12 of the English document book. Please give us your comments.
A. Under Cipher 367, "Repairs of motor vehicles and motor vehicle motors," information applied to Chief of Army Equipment and Commander of Replacement Training Army, and the last sentence of the document applies to the whole of the Waffen-SS.
By that I wish to say that the Army ordinance therefore applied to the whole of the Waffen-SS.
Q: My next document will be Document No. 9 which will be Exhibit No. 8 and it is on page 15 of the English Document Book. If the Tribunal please, may I please read this short document? It says:
"The carrying out regulations concerning the use of Wehrmacht motor vehicles in war time, issued with ordnance OKW/Chief WKW Az. 46a (2) Section Mot./Gr.K. Verw. (b) dated 28 July 1944 and published in the General Army Bulletin of 7 August 1944 under current No. 411, have also to be applied analogously to the entire Waffen-SS."
That again shows quite clearly that as far as transport matters were concerned the defendant Scheide worked on Army orders. That is why I submitted this document.
Then I shall now come to Document No. No. 10.
A: Excuse me, doctor, let me say something about this document.
Q: Yes, do.
A: When Army vehicles were used in War time this order of 15 September 1944 established a new regulation within the Army which I shall have reference to later on. This means that Oswald Pohl had taken over all the vehicles of the whole land and he used them from Army Motor Pools. After 15 September 1944 no office chief could do with his own vehicle what he wanted to. All vehicles were concentrated in the Army Motor Pool. The inspectors of these Army Motor Pools were 20 generals of the Luftwaffe. The transport situation had become so difficult that only generals were in position to master the situation.
Q: Then I shall submit document 10 which will become Exhibit No. 9. It makes reference to the records about trips. Will you tell us something about that?
A: That is the same thing as we saw in the other documents, according to technical ordinance bulletin.
Q: Then we reach document No. ii which will be Exhibit No. 10 on page 15 of the English Document Book. Will you tell us something about that, please?
A: Under Cipher 671 - Statement of the services done and supplies delivered by the Wehrmacht. (letter OKW - Chief WKW - GR.IV i Az. 76a 80 dated 3 July 1944). In this document it is ordered very clearly that all vehicles which were at the disposal of civilian agencies or civilian persons and had been turned over to the Wehrmacht had to be supplied by work shops of the Wehrmacht. This applied to all building maintenance because we have heard here that supplies of spare parts from civilian firms became possible although it was not possible before. If done before it was not in accord with regulations.
Q: Then finally as far as transport matters are concerned I shall submit another document which is Scheide Document No. 15 which will become Exhibit No. ii on page 22 of the English Document Book. Will you give us your comment about that please?
A: Document No. 15 of 1 July 1944, Section 350, shows once more quite clearly that all requests which are mentioned here under 350 had to be worked exclusively by the Main Operational Office. In this document I would like to draw attention to the fact that the old regulations still applied to supply of armament. I shall later on say something about that when I speak about arms and equipment. Then in the document itself the last sentence "Spare parts for motor vehicles are to be requisitioned from the competent Motor Pool or Ordnance Supply Depot." They are both Army agencies.
Q: Witness, I have submitted these documents to the court. How many such documents would reach you per month, roughly?
A: Once a fortnight orders would come in and they would pass on once a fortnight.
Q: Witness, you told us before that you introduced yourself to Gluecks as chief of Office Group D and that Gluecks was somewhat "upish" with you. Did he have a transportation officer of his own and who was that?
A: Yes, he had a transportation officer whom the Main Operational Office had put at his disposal. What I said about the WVHA and my connections with it - this a man was associated with Gluecks at Oranienburg. Vehicles which had been allocated to building operations, building inspectorate of concentration camps - no matter what agency at all - were all under the commanding officer of the officer of the office chief. Attached to him there is the transportation personnel, the responsible man for the use of the vehicles, for the maintenance for all the other thousand things is the commanding officer. The technical aspect of maintenance and to help the commanding office to keep the whole thing going is lack of the technical officer, but no transportation officer has the right to say anything about the use of the vehicles, that is up to the commanding officer.
Q: Witness, I have understood that you were not in a position to direct the vehicles but I would like to ask you, as far as the Office Group D was concerned did you have to look after the maintenance of concentration camp vehicles, for instance what vehicles belonged to Office Group D? Did it include the vehicle of the commanding officer and what was it you had to do about that. Please tell us about that.
A: The Transportation Officer of Office Group D had each month to fill in a printed form, saying how many vehicles he had at the time and that meant all agencies of Office Group D. Whether he delivered these by telephone or letter does not matter. The man responsible to pass on these reports was not the Transportation Officer but the Office Group chief and the Office Group chief was responsible to Pohl. The same applied to requests for fuel, tires, spare parts, etc.
JUDGE PHILLIPS: I don't think the witness has answered your question at all. Ask him to answer your question.
Q: Witness, I would like to come back to this what I asked you was - I have understood you to say that you had nothing to do with the actual directing of the vehicles, the use being made of them. But please tell us what sort of vehicles belonged to the Office Group D. Did it include vehicles or concentration camp and did you have anything to do with it?
A: I did not have anything to do with the vehicles themselves. Of course, the vehicles of the concentration camp were part of Office Group D. Did it include vehicles or concentration camp and did you have anything to do with it?
A: I did not have anything to do with the vehicles themselves. Of course, the vehicles of the concentration camp were part of Office Group D.
Q: And who worked there as an expert?
A: Hauptsturmfuehrer Schulz.
Q: And did he not have to say anything about the use of vehicles but only the same task as you describe as being your task?
A: Hauptsturmfuehrer Schulz had as little to do with vehicles as I did.
Q: Who was it who actually used the vehicles for concentration camps, for instance?
A: The use of vehicles in concentration camps depended entirely on the commandant.
THE PRESIDENT: Dr. Hoffmann we will take a recess at this time.
THE MARSHAL: The Tribunal is again in session.
DR. HOFFMANN: Witness, did you ever inspect on the spot the trucks which belonged to the various Office Groups? Would you please answer my question including Amtsgruppe D.
A. No, I never carried out any inspections. These inspections were carried out during peacetime. However, during the war we neither had the time nor the possibility to do so. Even in the concentration camps I never carried out any inspections for the very simple reason that Gruppenfuehrer Gluecks told me explicitly that I had nothing to do there and that it was none of my business to be there; Since I didn't know at the time of my transfer that the entire Amtsgruppe D would be part of it now, the Operational Main Office also confirmed the fact to me by telling me: "It is none of your business. That is the business of the technical officer whom we have sent there."
DR. HOFFMANN: I would like to draw the Tribunal's attention to my document book No. 2, page 53 of the English document book, and I would like to introduce now an affidavit by a certain man named Kaindl. This affidavit was introduced before the I.M.T. as an affidavit by the defense. It is on page 52 of Document Book II Scheide, your Honors. Do your Honors find that or don't you have Document Book No. 11.
JUDGE MUSMANNO: I don't have II. All right. We will use these.
DR. HOFFMANN: It deals with Scheide Document No. 33 which will become Exhibit No. 12. That is an affidavit by the last commander of the concentration camp Sachsenhausen and, as I stated before, it was introduced before the I.M.T. This affidavit in it's main part deals with organizational questions and I would like to stress this affidavit in that it is of great importance to me because it was given at a time when no one thought that there would be a trial against the WVHA. I would like to draw the Tribunal's attention to page 55 of the English Document Book where it is stated verbally from about the middle of the first paragraph there on page 55.
And I quote:
"From about the middle of 1940, the designation of the 'Inspector of the Concentration Camps.' was established. The commander was responsible in each case to Himmler with regard to the transfer of the concentration camps within the sphere of duty of the **-WVHA as of 1 April 1942; the designation of the commander was as follows:
"'SS-Economic and Administrative Main Office, Office Group D, Inspector of the Concentration Camps,' and it was under the personal command of the Chief of the SS-Economic and Administrative Main Office, Oswald Pohl."
I would like to stress this word "personal command" because this will be absolutely decisive for the position of the defendant Scheide.
Then I would appreciate it if the Tribunal would also take a look at page 74 of the affidavit where it is stated in paragraph IV:
"Issuing of orders by the Office Group D of the SS Economic and Administrative Main Office:
"The office group D 'Inspectorate for Matters Pertaining to Concentration Camps' had the following tasks:
"Office I -- Collaboration with Offices IV and V of the Reich Security Main Office with regard to new prisoners, transfer of prisoners to other concentration camps, release of prisoners in special cases, forwarding of orders for executions issued by the Reich Security Main Office.
"Office II: Organization of the labor allocation of inmates, negotiations with the Reich offices and firms in question.
"Office III: Execution of all medical and hygenic measures in the concentration camps.
"Office IV: Administrative matters pertaining to concentration camps, finance, accommodations, clothing, and food."
DR. HOFFMANN: What Amtsgruppe did Schulz belong to?
A. He belonged to Amtsgruppe D.
DR. HOFFMANN: I would like to refer the Tribunal to Office I where Schultz was working, where it says "transfer of prisoners to other concentration camps." Therefore, it is absolutely logical that the man who was in charge of transportation was also a member of office I.
THE PRESIDENT: Will you say that over again? What do you claim as to this first paragraph? What does it prove?
DR. HOFFMANN: Schulz, since he was in charge of transportation in office D, as the witness Scheide testified, also was a member of D, to be sure. Amtsgruppe D- I. Under the tasks of office I it is stated "transfer of inmates from one concentration camp to the other." Schulz consequently was added to Office I.
THE PRESIDENT: You infer from that Scheide, who was in office V, had nothing to do with the transportation of prisoners?
DR. HOFFMANN: Yes, indeed your Honor.
THE PRESIDENT: That belongs in Office I, under Schulz?
DR. HOFFMANN: Yes, indeed, your Honor.
THE PRESIDENT: Do you overlook the statement that Schulz was to collaborate with offices IV and V?
DR. HOFFMANN: Yes, your Honor. However, in this particular affidavit they were speaking about the competence itself within Amtsgruppe D and not about the office bearing the same number within the WVHA. None of them here has indicated the various offices of Amtsgruppe D.
Your Honor, may I be more precise about it?
THE PRESIDENT: I think we understand it now.
BY DR. HOFFMANN:
Q. Witness, we are now speaking about motor transportation as such in general and we have explained to this Tribunal what you had to do in that respect with the exception of Amtsgruppe D. Now, before you stated that you also were in charge of a motor pool. Would you explain to the Tribunal what kind of a motor pool this was, and how many vehicles that motor pool contained?
THE PRESIDENT: If there is anybody that knows what a motor pool is, we do. You needn't explain it.
A. The same thing applied to us, too, your Honor.
THE PRESIDENT: I hope not.
BY DR. HOFFMANN:
However, this Tribunal would perhaps be interested to know how many vehicles were contained in that motor pool, that particular motor pool of which the defendant Scheide was in charge.
A. That motor pool which was in Berlin in the Duererstrasse was only responsible for the supplying of the main office in Berlin; that is to say, things needed for the mess, stationery supplies, and all the little things that were a part of it all.
Q. How many vehicles did you have in there?
A. We had 30 trucks and 20 sedans.
Q. Who in this particular case was to tell them where to go?
A. It was done in the following manner: 24 hours in advance these vehicles were requested or applied for, depending on whether a vehicle had completed it's tour or not. Then they were assigned to a different trip and they were approved by me personally.
Q. Was that the only and individual case where you could tell them what trips to make?
A. Yes.
A. Witness, did your motor pool also transport inmates or were inmates ever transported by any of the vehicles in your motor pool?
A. During the entire period of my activity in the WVHA not on a single occasion were inmates driven by those trucks nor were any trucks ever requested from us for such purposes, as I stated before. It was the task, and the sole task, of the commanders to transfer the inmates and to handle these matters with supply trucks in the concentration camps. This job was not within the field of tasks in the office of B-V.
Q. Now, witness, I can recall that Tschentscher mentioned one single occasion here in the witness stand when he applied to you in order to take care of an urgent transport for the camp Dora. Can you recall that, and what was it all about?
A. That is the way it was. At the time when Tschentscher applied for these trucks and vehicles in B-5, the vehicles were no longer under B-5. After Tschentscher had made this statement here I spoke to him about it, and I told him that I couldn't recall such a request. At that time the Army motor pools which were established towards the middle of 1944, were already in existence and as of the first of September they were introduced for all the agencies of the Wehrmact.
I would like to tell you the purpose of these army motor pools. Generally speaking, it is usual that trips which had to be taken by one of the agencies were carried out during the daytime. That is, up to the great break-through by the Russians when they arrived at a distance of sixty kilometers from Berlin, we had lost 700,000 vehicles in the Eastern area alone; Hitler now ordered a combing out of all the last reserves. General Koll, the chief of the Army Transportation System issued a basic order in order to set up such an army motor pool system. These army motor pools had the purpose of utilizing everything that could be used as transportation in the homeland for the purpose of having the vehicles rolling day and night.
Distribution of fuel was no longer to be placed fundamentally in the hands of any agency chiefs, but that distribution had to be carried out by the Army Transportation System. That meant a complete change in the transportation system. No General, no general-field marshal--nobody, could exclude himself from that army motor pool. Therefore, no agency chief, regardless if he was a concentration camp commander or an air corps general or an army general, -- even Obergruppenfuehrer Pohl -nobody had the right to dispose over his own vehicle or vehicles.
The German Army motor pool chief was the only one who could make decisions. It can be seen from that, and the fact is also explained from that with reference to all the final transportation which was carried out regardless of what area it was carried out in, only the chief in charge of the motor pool could give any information about it because he was the one who controlled the whole thing centrally.