A. Yes, quite.
Q. And you were chief of the main office?
A. Yes, quite.
Q. During what period of time were you chief of the personal staff of Himmler?
A. It was in the summer of 1936 that I became the chief of the Hauptamt and chief of the personal staff. Before that I was only chief adjutant, and in my position as chief adjutant I had no disciplinary and command authority of my own, but only the task of transmitting the wishes and orders from my chief to other agencies. The promotion to the level of the highest responsibilities in the SS, that of department chief, which was even higher than the Higher SS Leaders and leaders in the SS, meant that I had authority to give orders of my own.
Q. Excuse me, until what date did you hold this position as chief of the personal staff?
A. Until the 18th of February, 1943. In practice entirely and as a main task only to the outbreak of the war, 1st of September, 1939, because with the outbreak of the war I entered into the Fuehrer Headquarters as liaison officer of the Waffen SS to the Fuehrer, and I could only handle that as a sideline.
Q. You received mail during the year 1942 at the ReichsfuehrerSS personal staff, did you not? You received mail addressed to you in care of the personal staff of Himmler?
A. I received such matters in the headquarters and such mail addressed to me as had been ordered by the Reichsfuehrer to be dealt with. Other matters bypassed me.
Q. Just for my own information, was there another person on the personal staff of Himmler by the name of Wolf, who spelled his name W-o-l-f, a single "f"? Do you know such a person?
A. I only recollect that temporarily a stenographer, or some female employee had been Gisela Wolf with one "f", but at the moment I cannot recollect any other person with one "f".
Q. You are presently a British prisoner of war?
A. Please?
Q. Are you presently a British prisoner of war?
A. Yes, I am at the moment a British prisoner of war, quite.
Q. Is it true that you made a request during the trial, the I. M.T. proceedings, to take Himmler's place in that trial?
A. Yes, a year ago.
Q. Yes, and that was because you had extensive knowledge, was it not, of Himmler's activities? Just answer yes or no.
A. Yes.
Q. Now, Witness, we have heard quite a lot in this trial about the Fuehrer Prinzip. I think you are in a very good position to tell us just what that principle was.
A. May I point out to you that the last parts of the translation have been most distorted, and therefore I couldn't quite answer the questions. Maybe you could have them repeated slowly and clearly.
Q. Are you familiar with the Fuehrer Prinzip?
A. Yes, indeed.
Q. I believe you are in an excellent position, General, to tell us the meaning and the significance of that principle. Would you do so?
A. Yes. The Fuehrer principle embodies entire responsibility on the part of an individual person and has far-reaching possibilities. of decision. A reasonable leader is a leader personality, conscious of his highest duties as a trustee for his people, of the unit he leads, and who also, in the case of increasing successes will remain within his boundaries. It is a most wonderful thing which one can prove by means of historical events, not only in the past, but also in the present.
Q. General, I just want a factual description of the principle, and I don't care for a characterization of it. Just tell me how it operated in practice.
A. The German Fuehrer principle, as far as I am able to describe to you the answer to such a difficult question off-hand, which is really a doctor's thesis, continued up to the Sudeten German case, and it meant to us in Germany an excellent and successful function since generally speaking upon the seizure of power we had seven million unemployed.
Q. Excuse me, I am afraid you don't understand my question. Just tell me how the principle operated, what it meant in practice, what it meant in terms of responsibility of the subordinates to the superior. I don't care to know about whether it was successful or unsuccessful. Just give me a factual description of the principle.
A. The principle would emphasize an individual personality within the framework of a state or its armed forces who carries full responsibility before his followers and subordinates.
Q. And it meant absolute responsibility and absolute power, is that right?
A. It required absolute responsibility, yes, power, yes, and the possibility to transmit one's will into facts.
Count No. II, Case No. 4.
Q Would you say that the entire Reich government was organized on this principle?
A I know that the Reich government was based upon that principle, yes.
Q And would you say that the SS was organized on that principle?
A Of course.
Q And the Reich leadership of the SS was organized on that principle?
A The Reichsfuehrer SS was also, of course, based upon that principle, yes.
Q I forgot to ask you, General, on the seniority list of Obergruppenfuehrers, do you recall where you ranked; you ranked pretty high, didn't you--on the seniority list of Obergruppenfuehrers?
A Yes, but might I ask the interpreter to speak less loudly because the microphone is reverberating to such an extent that, for instance, I couldn't understand the last question with absolute certainty. May I repeat your question in order to show if I understood it correctly? I think you asked whether in the list of ranks of the SS I occupied a very high rank and a very great seniority. The answer is yes, I did.
Q Do you recall where in the rank of seniority you were listed, approximately; what was it? Tenth, eleventh?
A That was a little too low... It is very difficult. I understood your question to be: "Do you remember the number which you held on the seniority list?" Was that your question?
Q Yes. How many people were ahead of you on the seniority list of Obergruppenfuehrers?
A The list of Obergruppenfuehrers was principally composed according to the day of appointment, but that doesn't reflect the actual rank and position, only the day of commissioning. To my recollection, on the last list of leaders, I was approximately under "37."
But in reality, according to my position I ought to have been farther ahead since all honorary Reich leaders and Reich ministers and such came ahead of me.
Q You know that the WVHA was a Main Office in the Reich leadership SS? Do you not --
A I couldn't understand. You knew what?
Q The WVHA was a Main Office?
A Correct. The WVHA was a main office of the SS--one of twelve, in fact.
Q And do you know that it was divided into five Amptsgruppen or office groups?
A Well, the organization in detail is only known to me rather generally, but not so accurately that I could state it here under oath as to its details. I mean, I think there were about five Amptsgruppen.
Q I am only asking you for the best of your recollection on this. You have seen tables of organization in your office of the WVHA, have you not?
A It is possible, in fact probable, that at some time or other it passed through my office, yes.
Q Will you look at the chart on the wall, please, to refresh your recollection generally about the organization of the WVHA? And I would point out that there was a mistake in the construction of the chart in that Amtsgruppe A is not intended to be shown as superior to B, C, D and W, or that B is superior to C, D and W. I just point that out for your own information. You know also, General, that each office group or each Amtsgruppe was divided into offices or Amts.
A I know that each Amtsgruppe was subdivided, yes.
Q And you know, do you not, that the WVHA handled the budget, treasury, finance, payroll, procuring of funds, and auditing for certain departments of the SS?
A Well, I haven't been trained as an administrative leader.
Court No. II, Case No. 4.
My knowledge deals with practical experience of many years which only covers the large-scale organization--not the observation of detail.
Q Well, you know generally that the WVHA handled the budget for the SS, don't you?
A I don't hear a thing.
DR. SEIDL: I just wanted to point out, Your Honor, that the difficulties in translation are apparently due to the fact that next to the voice of the interpreter there is some static noise coming over the channel, and maybe it might be possible to rectify this technical deficiency.
THE PRESIDENT: Try it again, Mr. Robbins.
BY MR. ROBBINS:
Q You know generally, don't you, that the WVHA handled the budget for the SS?
A Yes, I do.
Q You also know that Amtsgruppe A was in charge of the budget and finances, don't you?
A To my knowledge, yes.
Q Now, who in Amtsgruppe A handled the budget and treasury? What person--for the SS?
A May I ask to have the question repeated once again by the interpreter? (Question repeated) To my knowledge it was Obergruppenfuehrer Frank.
Q You also know that this Amtsgruppe handled the budget and financing of the concentration camps, do you not?
A Well, that is going into detail to a considerable extent. As far as I know the dividing line of districts are as follows--
Q Excuse me, do you know that, or don't you know it? That Amtsgruppe handled-
AAll I know is that it would be better to say that he, on a ministerial level, had to give the general instructions for the sphere of work, where on the provincial level the same was handled by Court No. II, Case No. 4.the subordinate offices.
Q You know that Amtsgruppe W was in charge of the economic enterprises of the WVHA, do you not?
A I just heard something about scientific... By scientific do you mean economic? Oh, I see--economic. To the best of my knowledge the answer is yes.
Q Well, you are pretty sure about it, aren't you. You have given us a good deal of detail about several of the individual office chiefs a few moments ago. Yon know who had control of the -
Isn't it coming through? (To Interpreter)
INTERPRETER: It is coming through but the interpreter's voice is practically inaudible to the witness. It is being repeatedly distorted.
THE PRESIDENT: Wait a minute, Mr. Robbins. (To Interpreter) Are you checking it?
INTERPRETER: It is being checked but I don't know how far it's got with it. We should like to try it again, please.
BY MR. ROBBINS:
Q General, I ask you who in the WVHA supervised the economic enterprises, the SS industries--what amt? What Amtsgruppe, first.
A I regret that I can't give any information to the Prosecutor about such far-reaching details.
Q Well, General, I am astonished; on Direct Examination you gave us the most minute details about even an individual office chief, several of them; in some cases about office chiefs in W. How is it that you can't recall now what Amtsgruppe W, the entire office, did?
WITNESS: Might I ask the High Tribunal for one thing and ask the interpreter not take this personally, but since in such important questions the correct answer is of the greatest importance to all the defendants here, I should be obliged if somehow a replacement could be made so that I could understand the voice more correctly. In the entire previous session yesterday and today, I had no difficulty. I don't know whether it is my personal error or whether it was the voice of the translator -- interpreter's voice -- but it is a tremendous handicap.
THE PRESIDENT: Are you all having difficulty?
It is very important that the witness understand exactly what the question is. If he can't hear it, we shouldn't put him under that handicap. Apparently, the defect in the transmission system, whatever it is, cannot be rectified in a moment, especially because we can't find the electrician and the Signal Officer to do it. I see no alternative at this time except to recess at this time and reconvenue at 1:30. We will recess.
MR. ROBBINS: Your Honor, may I make a request to the Tribunal. We are coming now in to a very important phase of the examination of this witness and I respectfully ask that he be instructed not to speak to any defense counsel about his testimony. I make that request without casting as aspersions on any one, but I think it is very important that answers not be suggested. Your Honor, I think it is quite different from the case of a defendant. It might comprise depriving a defendant of the right to counsel, if he weren't allowed to talk to his counsel, but in the case of a witness, I can see that no harm whatever might be done.
THE PRESIDENT: Since the defense counsel won't have an opportunity nor have time to talk to the witness, it is a rather strange principle and I don't recall that in any part of American Jurisprudence that counsel can't talk to his own witness during the cross-examination. However, we will cross that bridge another time. Today it will be solved by counsel not having an opportunity to talk to the witness and that will protect you. Sooner or later we are going to have to meet this question and I suggest to you there must be some authority for you to base this on before the Tribunal would accede to it. I have never heard of a witness being sequestered from the counsel who calls him merely because cross-examination is interrupted, and we should be very deliberate in attempting any such instruction.
MR. ROBBINS: Very well, Your Honor, I will prepare an oral or written argument on the point. I think that Wigmore supports me in that position and sites cases to that effect, It is certainly not unusual in the case of witnesses. I think it is not unusual.
THE PRESIDENT: Well, all right. We'll take one point at a time. We will recess until 1:30.
THE MARSHAL: This Tribunal is in recess until 1:30.
(A recess was taken until 1330 hours.)
Court No. II, Case No. 4.
AFTERNOON SESSION
THE MARSHAL: The Tribunal is again in session.
KARL WOIFF - RESUMED CROSS EXAMINATION - CONTINUED BY MR. ROBBINS:
Q Witness, before the recess we were talking about the SS industries, the economic enterprises under the WVHA, and I asked you what Amtsgruppen in the WVHA supervised these industries.
A The economic enterprises of the SS were, as far as I know, administered and supervised by Amtsgruppe W, which in turn was supervised by Gruppenfuehrer Pohl, as far as I remember, in 1942.
Q You have told us that Pohl was a very busy man, which he undoubtedly was. Pohl himself could not supervise all of the hundreds of industries that were in Amtsgruppe W. Who in Amtsgruppe W carried out the supervision?
AAs far as I can remember, he had a deputy for that purpose.
Q And he had a staff?
A Yes, he had a staff or under him there were the various offices, the spheres of which have been touched upon by the various Defense Counsel and about which I can for that reason, give very exhaustive information on because I myself dealt with these people, such as Klein and Mummenthey.
Q And do you know that it was the function of Staff W to supervise these industries, these workshops, the enterprises?
AAs far as the actual supervision, the duty to supervise is concerned, I do not know very much. All that I know is that the channel went via Gruppenfuehrer Pohl, to whom I would myself ring them up if I had an order or a wish of the Reichsfuehrer to transmit or carry out.
Q I don't mean, General, that the chiefs of staff W and the chiefs of the various Amts in Amtsgruppe W actually were at each of the plants physically supervising the work, but it was their responsibility, wasn't it, to see that the work was carried out in the industries under Court No. II, Case No. 4.their supervision?
A Yes, quite.
Q And it was the responsibility of the office chiefs to see that --Well, for instance, let's take an example. The DEST, the Deutsche Erd und Steinweke, was under the defendant Mummenthey. Mummenthey was chief of Amt W-I. You know, don't you, that it was his responsibility to see that the DEST industries were properly run?
AAs I said in a previous interrogation, it so happens that the whole DEST complex is relatively unknown to me. I had no intimate contacts there. If the Prosecution could take the Allach porcelain manufacture or the Bohemia, for example, I would be in a better position to give a responsible and precise answer.
Q All right, let's take the Bohemia. Which Amt was the Bohemia under?
A Bohemia was, as far as I know, under the office of the defendant Mummenthey.
Q And what supervision did Mummenthey exercise over the plant?
A From my own knowledge I can not give any information here, but he transmitted the orders and wishes of the Reichsfuehrer to manufacture certain plates and so forth, and if I have understood the question correctly, he could be described as being responsible for Bohemia.
Q And you told us about Allach, that it was Himmler's idea to make porcelain horses that would stand up on their hind legs. Mummenthey was in charge of this, wasn't he?
A Mummenthey had to see to it that the manufacturing and selling of all products of the porcelain manufacturing would be carried out according to the directives and wishes of the Reichsfuehrer.
Q Well, in your opinion, Mummenthey deserves a great deal of credit for supervising Allach and seeing that these beautiful porcelain pieces were properly manufactured?
Court No. II, Case No. 4.
A Yes. In my eyes and from what I have heard up to this hour, he carried out this function in a proper and responsible and decent way, incorruptibly. I never heard anything to his disadvantage as far as his personality or his business management were concerned.
Q And he undoubtedly kept a pretty close check on the conditions in Allach and what was going on in the plant, don't you think?
A I said before he did not discuss that with me personally, but I do not doubt that he did his duty and that he will be in a position to prove that.
Q But you are certain that it was his responsibility to see that the plant at Allach was properly run?
A I think that the technical or commercial manager of Allach would probably have looked after all of the main details, but the way I would like to put it would be that Mummenthey was generally responsible.
Q That is put very well. He was generally responsible for all of the industries under Amt I, wasn't he?
AAs far as I know as a non-economist and a non-member of the WVHA, yes.
Q Let's look at W-III, for instance. There is no one in the dock, no defendant from W-III. This was food manufacturing, and the Deutsche Lebensmittel G.m.b.H, German Foodstuffs, Ltd., was under W-III. Do you know who was the chief of W-III?
A No, not by heart.
Q Do you remember the name Moeckel, M-O-E-C-K-E-L?
A Moeckel, yes I do indeed.
Q Do you know that he was chief of W-III?
A No, but I know that he had an office within the WVHA.
Q You would assume, wouldn't you, that Moeckel, as head of W-III -- I'll tell you for your information that he was head of W-III-You would assume that the chief of W-III also had general supervision over the Deutsche Lebensmittel, G.m.b.H., would you not?
A Yes.
Court No. II, Case No. 4.
Q Are you familiar with the firm DWB, Deutsche Wirtschaftsbetriebe, G.m.b.H?
A No.
Q You have not heard of that name before, the German Economic Enterprises?
A No, I do not know this abbreviation or the field of task that we are concerned with here.
Q Never mind the abbreviation. The full name is Deutsche Wirtschaftsbetriebe, G.m.b.H. You don't know that name?
A No, I am afraid that it does not mean anything to me. Perhaps the Prosecution could tell me what they produced there.
Q That was the holding company, the giant holding company which controlled all of the concerns in the WVHA. Are you familiar with the firm OSTI Industry -- G.m.b.H. Eastern Industries, Ltd.?
A I came across that term here in Nurnberg for the first time.
Q And you don't know who exercised supervision over this industry? It was an industry under Amtsgruppe W and under the Staff W.
A I can not recall this at all.
Q Do you know the defendant Baier? His name is Hans Baier. He was an Oberfuehrer in the SS.
A The name seems to ring a bell, but I must admit that if I were to attempt to point him out here, I would be unable to do so. I don't think that I ever had any direct official contacts with him.
Q Do you know who in the WVHA handled the administration of supply for the SS? Do you know that was Amtsgruppe B?
A May I ask the Prosecution what you mean by "supplies"?
Q Well, I am talking about billets and food supplies and clothing, transportation.
A I know that Office Group B was under Brigadefuehrer Loerner at the time. I also know that the defendant Scheide was connected with transportation matters.
Court No. II, Case No. 4.
Q You told us yesterday that you knew that the WVHA generally had to supply food and other supplies for the concentration camps. Do you know that this was Amtsgruppe B's function?
A I believe that I did not use the term "to supply". What I wanted to express was that the WVHA and agencies within the WVHA-There was Office Group B under Loerner which had the authority to issue general orders, to cover the supplies in the provincial agencies. I am thinking of clothes, particularly, to transfer them, but if the Prosecution should assume-- I want to say that I don't believe that Loerner was the source from which the food supplies would come. As far as I can judge this from the outside, these allocations came from the supply agencies of the Reich Food Estate, and that at a lower level the concentration camps themselves regulated it locally.
Q. Well, you told us yesterday that WVHA you knew was in charge of the administration of the concentration camps? You know that is true, don't you?
A. (No answer)
Q. Let me ask you this. You know that Amtsgruppe-D was in charge of administering concentration camps?
A. Yes.
Q. And you know that "D" was part of the WVHA and was subordinate to Pohl?
A. Yes, indeed.
Q. Now you told us that Pohl was a very busy man, and it was impossible that Pohl himself could have taken care of all the supplies for the concentration camps. He must have had some one of his deputies in charge of the checking to see that the inmates in the concentration camps received food and do thing, or do you think he just ignored that problem completely. It was his responsibility. What do you think he did about it?
A. Office Group-D just mentioned by the Prosecution is named Inspectorate of Concentration Camps. This designation shows that he had the duty to inspect the camps from the point of view of being the proper and regular supplies; therefore, from my own knowledge I would, so far as Chief of Office Group-D is concerned, wish to say as to the nominating inspector of the concentration camps, that I would have regarded him to be the mainly responsible person.
Q. You see on the chart up there of Amt-B-I, that Tschentscher was in charge of food supplies, and Amt-B-II is in charge of clothing.
A. Yes.
Q. Didn't you know that when the officials in Amtsgruppe D needed food for the concentration camps, they went to these offices?
A. No, I have no knowledge of that, that is a highly internal administration task. I said before that I believe that all material and supplies for uniforms, and such things, might have come from the top level administrative office of the Inspectorate of concentration camps.
The supplies to Office Group-B, I don't think this applied to food supplies, but I would ask you to bear in mind I never had any reason to inform myself of all the organizational details and competencies of another Hauptstamt (Main Office)-
Q. Well, by taking into consideration the Twelve main offices, you will ten exclude the possibility that it was Georg Loerner's task to obtain food and clothing for the concentration camps?
A. I am unable to say one-hundred percent yes or no, from my own knowledge I think it is highly improbably that Loerner had anything to do with the food supply in a responsible manner.
DR. KRAUSS: Dr. Krauss for the defendant Tschentscher. Mr. President, the witness has said on several occasions that he has no detailed knowledge of the task under the various groups, and main offices particularly. I would, therefore, request the Tribunal from the point of view of further questions concerning the competency of the office of Tschentscher about which the witness has already said he has no precise knowledge, I would ask that those questions should not be permitted.
MR. ROBBINS: I am not going to ask any more questions about Tschentscher.
THE PRESIDENT: The Tribunal will bear in mind the witnesses testimony that he was not familiar with the details, and that some of his answers, many of them in fact, are not based upon personal knowledge but upon opposition.
MR. ROBBINS:
Q. What the President just said about your testimony, applies also to what you said this morning in answering the questions put to you by the defense counsel about Horst Klein, and other of the defendants doesn't it, that you were just supposing when you told us about these details of their tasks?
A. The answers which I made in response to questions put by the defense counsel were concerned essentially with definite concrete matters of which it so happened I had some knowledge about from my own official contact. I can see no reason to modify my testimony in response to questions put by defense counsel.
Q. General, do you know who Kammler was?
A. Yes, Kammler was the Chief of the entire Construction Department of the SS.
Q. And that came under Amt Group-C of which he was chief, did it not?
A. Yes, quite, so far as I know.
Q. Did you ever hear of the defendant Eirenschmalz?
A. Yes, I knew Eirenschmalz as an old SS man from the time -- from the Munich-SS; i.e. , in 1931, '32 and '33.
Q. Do you recall that he was Chief of Amt-C-6 under Kammler?
A. All I know is that he dealt with construction tasks. Details are difficult for me to recall , unless my memory might be refreshed by either the Prosecution or the Defense.
Q. He was also Himmler's Deputy for a time, was he not?
A. I don't know that in detail. I might testify again that I next saw him in the beginning of 1943.
Q. You know, do you not, that Kammler was completely subordinated to the defendant Pohl?
A. Kammler as Chief of Office Group, of course, was under Pohl.
Q. Well, there has been a lot of testimony here about the duties of Gluecks and Eicke as inspectors of the concentration camps, but I don't think any one has given us a completely clear picture as to what those men did as Inspectors of concentration camps prior to 1942, and, I should think that you would be in an excellent position to do so. Would you tell us about the tasks of these men?
A. The question of the Prosecution is, do I know other questions put to me by the defense where it would be a doctor's thesis, almost, to answer. The things go back a goad many years, and I should be glad to tell you what I know as briefly as possible.
Q. Well, let me tell you, that this is an extremely important subject, and just take your time in doing so.
A. I remember that in 1933 the then Oberfuehrer Eicke was asked by the Reichsfuehrer-SS to establish for Dachau concentration camp a sort of supervision for the possibility of guarding the inmates interned there. From those guard units originated the so-called concentration camp guard units, or Deathhead Units. As things developed, and as the functions of the Reichsfuehrer-SS grew and extended throughout Germany a number of other concentration camps were established and others from the responsibility and care of the SA. I am thinking of Oranienburg, were handed over to the responsibility of the SS. The official here who established the first concentration camp which the SS ever took over was Eicke. Eicke was given the authority for conducting and the responsibility for these newly created camps, and at that time the title of Inspectorate of concentration camps, and the inspector of concentration camps was given to him. Eicke at the outbreak of the war went to the Deathhead Units of the SS at Danzig when he returned from the Polish campaign.
From these concentration camp guards he found that the SS Death Head Division, SS Mechanized Division, "became part of the SS Special Task Groups and was thereby taken into the Waffen SS, and in France it was in combat for the first time.
These new tasks which Gruppenfuehrer Eicke took over after the war had broken out, it became necessary that his old position be given to somebody else, and it was Gluecks who became his successor. Thus he took over the task and the full responsibility, I am inclined to say even the main responsibility, for this very difficult and sad chapter.
BY JUDGE MUSMANNO:
Q. Witness, you mentioned the first concentration camp. Who constructed the first camp, whose idea was it?
A. A difference must be made here in what part of the country you are talking about. In northern Germany there were concentration camps which as far as I know were established by Goering, but in southern Germany--
Q. Well, the first concentration camp in Germany - would you say that Goering was the man who--
A. It was, as far as I know, by Goering.
Q. What year was it?
A. It must have been the beginning of 1933, immediately after the advent of power.
Q. Can you give us the philology of concentration camp? Why was it called a concentration camp? Was it the theory that you were concentrating in one place the opponents of the regime?
A. The explanation, that is how I understood it, and that is how I understand it, is that it was borrowed from the British, because the Germans did not invent the system of concentration camps.
Q. You mean to tell us that Great Britain had concentration camps prior to Goering's concentration camps?
A. Yes, in the Boer War.
Q. And were they called that, was that the term that was used?
A. From my own knowledge at the time, I was halfway informed, I think so.
Q. And did you adopt any other British custom in the beginning and carrying on of this war?
A. We always endeavored in the SS to borrow the term "gentleman" from the British and to carry it out, to train people to become gentlemen, but unhappily we were not nearly as successful as we would have been.
Q. Don't you think if you had followed out the British manner of living you might not have been in the mess that you are in now?
A. Yes, I believe so.
JUDGE MUSMANNO: Yes.
BY MR. ROBBINS:
Q. Witness, before I get completely away from Amtsgruppe C, Amtsgruppe C was in charge of all construction of the SS, wasn't it?
A. Might I ask that the question be repeated?
(The question was repeated by the interpreter to the witness.)
I am unable to say this so generally. For instance, recalling the construction of the Wewelsburg, which was a special task, there Kammler according to my knowledge had no connection with it at all. One has to be extremely cautious here before one generalizes. I would put it this way, that as far as I know all construction matters which were on the SS program and were not an exceptional enterprise were under the supervision and leadership and responsibility of Kammler.
Q. Do you know of any large construction projects that were carried out that were not under Amtsgruppe C, disregarding the small example such as Wewelsburg?
A. Not at this present moment, I cannot recall any other case.
Q. I don't know of any others. I am just asking for my own information.
A. Yes.
Q. Now, you have given us in considerable detail the jobs of Eicke and Gluecks. It is true, isn't it, that Eicke, as inspector of the concentration camps, had extensive control over the day-to-day living of the concentration camp inmates, regulations concerning the hours of working, the amount of sleep that the inmates would get, the amount of clothes, the amount of food, how long they would work, what kind of work they would do, etc.