A The Waffen SS?
Q Yes.
A No.
Q I understood you to say that -- if the translation was correct. That is all.
BY DR. SEIDL:
Q Witness, when in March, 1942, Himmler acquainted you with his decision to put the Inspectorate of the concentration camps under you as Chief of the WVHA; did he draw your attention expressly to the fact that this new relationship would be concerned only with questions of labor allocation; is that correct?
A He emphasized that expressly; I was to deal only with questions of labor allocation.
Q And furthermore, that the competence of the Inspectorate of the concentration camps and that of the RSHA -- would remain unchanged?
A That is correct too.
Q The Court asked you before what Office Groups were under your direction, for example, the WVHA, and you pointed out Office Groups A, B, C, and D, of which the WVHA consisted chiefly. Should you not also have referred to Office Group W, which was one of the original Office Groups of the WVHA?
A Office Groups A, B, and C were, as far as their competence is concerned, the actual office groups of the administrative center of the WVHA. Office Group W, in that form, was established only in 1942. Up to that moment the various economic enterprises which were part of it, were incorporated to the main office in a different manner. They were concentrated into an office group only in 1942, but that office group was also part of the WVHA, However, the difference was in its tasks; in its tasks it differed considerably from the other office groups.
Q I shall now turn to Document NI-034, in Document Book XI, on page 1, both in the English and the German texts. This was Exhibit 297, and it is an affidavit by Rudol Hoess, and I would like to ask you, witness, this is a somewhat elaborate statement, and I would like you to comment on those statements which seem to be important to you in connection with this trial, and where you are in a position to say something from your own knowledge.
A Once again I must correct Hoess' view which he has expressed under paragraph three. There he says that the WVHA, directed by Obergruppehfuehrer Oswald Pohl was responsible for all administrative work, such as housing, feeding and medical care in the concentration camps. This opinion one comes across time and again and it is only correct insofar as civil service authority is concerned. I have just said that the final agency for all these matters, since 1936, was the Inspectorate of the concentration camps, even after 1942, when it was called Office Group B. Here all these matters as far as housing, feeding and medical care was concerned, were dealt with finally. Now, the administrative authority of the WVHA dealt with only those questions which needed a Ministerial administrative decision. Then, paragraph B-1, on page 4, he says from 1940 on in the entire Reich territory so-called outside work camps were set up. From my own knowledge I could not confirm whether this is correct or not, but I am not inclined to assume it because as far as I have watched the developments myself, outside camps were set up only after 1942. Whether in exceptional cases before this time, inmates were sent to enterprizes outside the camps, do not know. In my interrogations I was frequently asked what priority existed as far as the labor allocation for the Buna Works in Auschwitz was concerned. On page 6 in Hoess' affidavit, paragraph 2, it becomes clear that Himmler in the spring of 1941 gave the orders to furnish ten thousand inmates of that camp for the construction of the Buna Works.
The employment of inmates in the mines of the Hermann Goering Works, of which he speaks at the bottom of page 7, I knew about. That employment was based on an order from Hitler himself which was transmitted through the OKW. The negotiations on that labor assignment Hoess had with the Reich Commissioner for Coal. The various persons and enterprises he names I did not know.
Q. As Exhibit 298 the prosecution has submitted an affidavit by a certain Phillip Grimm. This is Document NO-2126 in Document Book XI, page 20, page 11 of the English text. I would like you to comment on this affidavit, especially as far as the allegation is concerned that you as chief of the WVHA had issued the order on the basis of which release of inmates was stopped and that these inmates had to remain in custody.
A. I gave no such order. I was not in a position to issue such an order because I could not decide how long an inmate was to remain in custody. I said repeatedly that committing or releasing inmates was entirely the task of the RSHA.
Q. Another affidavit submitted by the prosecution comes from a certain Schwartz. This is Exhibit 299 and Document NO-2125, and it is on page 30 of the German book and on page 15 of the English Document Book XI. Can you comment on the assertions in this affidavit?
A. On page 32 Schwartz asserts in the case of all outside departments which were under Amtsgruppe W the respective chiefs of the office had to apply for these prisoners to D-II. This might create the impression as if all outside detachments worked under Office Group W, or at least were supervised by it. That is not correct. This only concerned those outside detachments which were part of the enterprises of Office Group W. His statement in the same paragraph that the housing and feeding of all outside detachments was a responsibility of Office D-II is incorrect also. For all those outside details and enterprises, as far as feeding, housing, and medical care were concerned, the man in charge of the enterprise was exclusively responsible, because without being prepared to look after that side of it he would not be given any inmates.
As far as transport questions are concerned, the following might be said quite generally. When inmates were transferred from one camp to the work camp, the transports were put together by the camp commandant. Only if transports were of a larger extent, between one camp and another, then sometimes Office D-II would take a hand. That is to say, when it was necessary to contact the Reich Ministry of Transport, Office D-II would negotiate with that Ministry. But the usual transports, which were of average size, were made by the camp commandants themselves.
On page 34 he refers to S-III, in the middle of page 34. Even as far as the providing of bread is concerned, S-III was not in a position to do this so that in the end the administration of Buchenwald itself had to be consulted. Schwartz was not quite aware of the channels there, because the outside camp, S-III, was economically part of the administration of the Buchenwald camp and therefore had to be provided with food and clothing from that camp.
Q. Now, Exhibit 301 is an affidavit by Kurt Parry. This is Document NI-310, Document Book 11, page 31 of the English book.
JUDGE MUSMANNO: Dr. Seidl, may I offer a suggestion, that in the examination of your witness if you could direct his attention specifically to the point that you desire to have discussed it would be easier to follow you, and I think you would cover the ground much more satisfactorily all the way around, rather than merely to invite his comment generally on a document. Let's have a specific question, answer, question, answer.
DR. SEIDL: I will put specific questions to the witness.
BY DR. SEIDL:
Q. In Exhibit 301 it is asserted among other things, on page 3, applications for the allocation of inmates were made by the firms on special forms, or were addressed to the camp commander. Is that correct, witness? This is on page 5 of the German text.
A. Such cases might have happened. I said before that enterprises would address themselves directly to the commandant of a camp.
Q. I shall now turn to Exhibit 305, which is Document NO-2326on page 60 of the English book. This is an affidavit by Dr. Katzenellenbogen, and on page 4 of the German text it says the following and I quote: "The camp commandant, Pister and Barnewald, went with Kammler of Amtsgruppe C to Dora, and Barnewald complained to Kammler that these conditions were impossible and that something must be done immediately." Dr. Kammler replied literally, "Gruppenfuehrer Pohl could not care less how many people will perish in this enterprise, and his only interest is to finish this construction enterprise as quickly as possible." I would like to ask you, witness, if this assertion by Katzenellenbogen is correct.
A. I am unable to investigate whether it is correct or not. I do not know whether Katzenellenbogen was present, which I think was unlikely because that remark--
TEE PRESIDENT: The point is, did you say what Kammler said you said. That is pretty bad. Are you quoted correctly in this statement?
Q. The Court has justifiably asked you that you should state whether you yourself made such a statement to Kammler.
A. That is a typical Kammler statement -
THE PRESIDENT: But is it true?
A. I am coming to that. No; all I wanted to do was to explain why it could not be true. In this sense I would not make such a statement either to Kammler or to anybody else. That would be indirect contradiction to all my efforts to have humane conditions.
BY DR. SEIDL:
Q. Prosecution Exhibit 310 is a letter of the Chief of Staff of the Waffen-SS to a number of agencies. This is Document NO-2143, in Document Book 11, on page 102, and page 99 of the English text. Are the contents of this letter known to you? It says here, among other things, and I quote:
"Reichsfuehrer-SS has ordered the transfer of the SS officers and guard detachments of the special camp Hinzert, and of the prison camps within the region of the West Wall into the Waffen-SS, and their subordination to the Inspector of Concentration Camps."
This letter is dated 27 June, 1940.
A. Nothing is known to me of this process.
Q. I shall now turn to Document NI-1240, on page 106 of the English text, Document Book XI. It is Prosecution Exhibit 314, and is a letter from Goering of 18 February 1941 which deals with letters of policy for the Auschwitz Buna plant. You, yourself, are not named in the distribution list of this document. I would like to ask you did you hear of this Goering letter of Goering through any other channel?
A. No.
Q. I shall turn to Document NO-3031, Document Book 11, on page 118 of the English text. This is a file note, and the Prosecution has submitted it as Exhibit 316. It concerns an inspection made by the Reichsfuehrer-SS in Lublin and Zamosz on 20 July 1941; and I would like to ask you, were you present in that inspection, and did you ever hear anything about the contents of this file note and the measures ordered in it by the Reichsfuehrer -SS?
A. I was not present when this inspection took place, and I assume that the note comes from Gruppenfuehrer Globocnik.
Q. I shall now turn -
A. May I perhaps point out one thing. In sub-paragraph 14 it says, "The organization of construction departments of Office 2 for the deputy of the Reichsfuehrer (building inspection, central construction managements, construction managements) appointed by SS-Gruppenfuehrer Pohl has been approved by the Reichsfuehrer-SS, as also the preliminary measures already introduced."
This refers to the new regulations in the construction program which at that time prevailed throughout the Reich and the occupied territories, and it is my belief that a central construction management was also located in Lublin.
Q. I now turn to Document NO-500 which is a telegram from Himmler to Gluecks, page 134 of the English Document Book XI. It says there at the end, and I quote verbatim:
"The concentration camps will have to deal with major economic problems and tasks in the coming weeks. SS-Gruppenfuehrer Pohl will inform you of particulars."
I would like to ask you, That were those economic problems and tasks?
A. This telegram dates from January, 1942, and I assume that it must be the big armament tasks which were imminent at that time, and which were tackled in the coming months. I do not recall in detail what is referred to here but I think it probably must have been this large-scale armament program which was begun in April and May of 1942.
Q. Then I shall turn to the last document in this document book. This is Document NO-596, on page 142 of the English Document Book. This is a letter which you, yourself, addressed to the Reichsfuehrer SS on 8 April 1942, and it concerns the construction and equipment of the Volkswagen-factory in Fallersleben.
THE PRESIDENT: Are you speaking about Exhibit 323. That is what we have on page 140. 142?
DR. SEIDL: I am talking of Exhibit 324. I have no question to ask the witness concerning Exhibit 323.
BY DR. SEIDL:
Q. I would like the witness to comment on paragraph 3 of this document, NO-596, where a Fuehrer Order is referred to. What can you tell us from your own knowledge about this?
A. At that time I and Prof. Borsche and Kammler negotiated on this business. The former Volkswagen factory in Fallersleben by virtue of a order of Hitler was to be changed into a foundry. And Kammler, as chief of Office Group C., was to be in charge of this reconversion. Himmler, himself, wished to have the management of this work under his influence. The construction work, as far as I can recall, was carried out by Kammler, but the other question -- that is to say, who was to be in charge of the enterprise -- was decided to Himmler's disadvantage.
THE PRESIDENT: Does that finish this book, Dr. Seidl?
DR. SEIDL: Yes, Mr. President.
THE PRESIDENT: We will take our recess at this time.
THE MARSHAL: This Tribunal will be in recess for fifteen minutes.
(A recess was taken.)
Court No. II, Case No. 4.
THE MARSHAL: Military Tribunal II is again in session.
BY DR. SEIDL:
Q As Exhibit No. 325, Amtsgruppe D, Office Group D, regarding concentration camps of the 1st May, 1942, this is Document NO-604, Document Book No. XII, page 2, both in the English and German texts; it deals with labor senate, clergymen labor; and I ask you now did you actually cause this letter to be written, and during your term of office, did you ever make any decision concerning labor assignment for clergymen? When you answer this question, please take a look at Document NO-1382 which has been introduced by the Prosecution as Exhibit 326.
A The order to employ every clergyman was issued by Himmler personally; in this case I remember exactly that as far as the employment of prisoners was concerned, he had ordered that they work in the gardens at Dachau; that was the reason why I had ordered that the clergymen work in the office, as it says in the last document.
Q As Exhibit 328 and 329 the Prosecution introduced two documents, and they referred to Himmler's order for armament work in the concentration camps. These are documents NO-598 and NO-3032, in Document Book XII, on page 7 of the German and the English books. Would you make a statement with reference to these two documents?
A Staatsrat Schieber at that time worked on the armament tasks in the Speer Ministry at the time. He discussed these matters repeatedly with Himmler as far as they referred to the concentration camps. As a result of these discussions I received a letter, Exhibit No. 328, from Himmler, and together with Schieber I discussed their execution in detail. The way they were carried out can be seen from Document No. NO-3032, and, consisted, first of all the construction, the Armament Industries of the Gustloff Works in the concentration camp of Buchenwald. In the course of the tie-over a few additional enterprises were incorporated in the concentration camps.
Q I shall now come to NO-497, which was introduced as Exhibit No. 332 by the Prosecution, in Document Book No. 12, on page 14 of the German text, and on page 27 of the English Document Book. That is a teletype from Brigdefuhrer Gluecks to Himmler's Adjutant, SSHauptsturmfuehrer Grothmann, and I ask you, did you know anything about that matter?
A No.
Q Then I shall come to Document No. 654-PS, which was introduced by the Prosecution as Exhibit No. 333, in Document Book No. 12, on page 28 of the English and on Page 15 of the German Document Book. This apparently is a record of discussions of officials of the Justice Ministry with the Reichsfuehrer-SS on 18 September 1942. The document bears neither date nor signature. Neither can it be seen by whom this report was written. I will ask you now, witness, did you know anything about the conference, and did you know anything about Himmler's intentions to destroy asocial element and professional criminals by work. Did you have any knowledge whatsoever about these developments?
A I did not participate in this conference, nor did I hear anything about it. The participants who are mentioned here belong to the Reichsministry of Justice, and the RSHA, and to Himmler's personal Staff. Neither did I have any knowledge of the contents, nor was I informed of the contents of these conferences later on, nor did Himmler ever issue any directive to me, or tole me anything to the effect that asocial elements were to be delivered to him by the penal execution authorities with the object of exterminating them by work.
MR. ROBBINS: I might say that the document which I have in my book is signed, and it is initialed "Th," which stands for "Thierach" who was Minister of Justice at the time, and who succeeded Schegelberger in that position.
DR. SEIDL: In the copy which I have "Th" is missing. However, I can recall that at a previous occasion, I have seen the document, and it is possible that the "Th" stands for "Thierach". But I can not make any statement to that effect of my own knowledge, nor does the witness know anything about the whole matter.
BY DR. SEIDL:
Q I shall now proceed to Document No. 1063-D-PS, in Document Book 12 on page 33 of the German and page 47 of the English Document Books. This document introduced as Prosecution Exhibit No. 340 by the Prosecution. This is a letter from the Chief of the Security Police and the SD to the Security Police Offices on 17 December 1942, and according to the distribution at the beginning of this document, it must be assumed that you have received knowledge of this. I ask you in what manner were you connect with that matter, and what did you do upon reading of this letter?
A I certainly received this letter at the time, because it was sent to me as an informational copy. I did not participate in the working out of this. And I do not recall having done anything in particular about that, because this was a State Police affair, which only had some sort of reference to me when the inmates had been sent to the concentration camp. Prior to that I had nothing to do with it.
Q Then I shall proceed to NO-2031 -- in Document Book 12, on page 55 of the English and page 41 of the German Document Books.
JUDGE MUSMANNO: Dr. Seidl, may I interrupt you an instant, as I would like to ask a question of Mr. Robbins. Do you know where this exMinister of Justice is now, is he living?
MR. BOBBINS: No, Your Honor, he is dead. He committed suicide.
BY DR. SEIDL:
Q We shall now proceed to Document NO-2031, in Document Book 12, on page 55 of the English, and on page 41 of the German Document Books. It was introduced as Prosecution's Exhibit No. 341, and it is an order of Himmler, Reichsfuehrer-SS, dated 6 January 1943, with reference to a circular regarding partisan families. What can you say about these documents, and did you become in any connection within this matter?
AAs far as sending people to the concentration camps, that is, people of this circle mentioned here, we complied with this order. In some of the factories we had training workshops. However, I can not tell if children and adolescents were also trained there. I can not recall having seen any. However, I did not visit all the training workshops. I would like to draw the Tribunal's attention to another fact pertaining to this document. The Reichsfuehrer-SS himself makes it clear that also the chief of the concentration camps, and the chief of the concentration camp of WVHA -----
Q You will have to repeat the last sentence. I understand the translation did not come through.
A I said that in this document here I would like to draw the Tribunal's attention to the fact that the Reichsfuehrer-SS himself on the part of the Chief of WVHA, and the Inspectorate of the concentration camps which are particularly mentioned here, proves that Himmler on the basis of their field tasks differentiates between the two.
THE PRESIDENT: You told us yesterday that it was your belief that all the people who were sent into your concentration camps were sent there for violating some regulations. Do you remember that?
THE WITNESS: Yes, I do.
Q Do you think these children that you were planning to bring up in confinement, and to Germanize, do you think they were sent because they violated some regulation?
A This deals with families of partisans in the case of persons who apparently dealt with partisan activity behind the front. I don't know the circumstances myself, because I don't know it from my own knowledge, and I only know them from this letter here.
Q Well, it dealt with people who just would not submit to German domination in their own countries, didn't it?
A Yes.
Q. It dealt with people who had the courage to resist the intrusion of the Germans into their own homeland?
A. Yes.
Q. Including children?
A. Yes. I can see that from this document. I do not know what the individual people, did, and according to which regulations they were prosecuted. I had no influence on sending these people out there, nor did I have any influence on their arrest, or the circle of people arrested.
Q. I know you knew nothing about anything, but do you now believe that these young children were guilty of breaking regulations and for that reason were thrown into concentration camps?
A. I do not know that. Probably the children were taken along because their parents were taken away.
Q. And the wives were taken along because their husband were taken along.
A. That quite possible.
Q. In other words, you were simply deporting whole families and villages.
A. Your Honor, I had nothing -
Q. I know, you know nothing about it.
A. I only know that about it which is here in this document. I did not participate in those things. I did not review any regulations about it, nor can I make any statement about it, other than what it says in the document. I didn't find out anything more about that myself. Children and women also participated in the partisan activities when they were fighting the German troops. That happened, the same way in all countries, and I believe the German women and children would have done the same thing.
Q. All you did was to receive them when somebody else sent them into the camps.
A. I had some sort of a contact with these people when they were in the concentration camps. Prior to that I didn't know anything. Myself, I didn't see these people in the concentration camps. I didn't see any juveniles in the concentration camps themselves, and after all I didn't see all the concentration camps.
Q. Well, it all comes down to this, somebody else captured than and you imprisoned them.
A. I did not imprison them. I couldn't prevent it, Your honor, that they were sent to concentration camps. I did not take one single measure, I did not issue one single order in order to send people to concentration camps.
Q. I know that; I know that. All you did Was to hang on to them after somebody else sent them.
A. I personally could not send them away. I did not stand at the gate and say, "You can go home," because I did not see them when they arrived. What am I to do? I was in Berlin. I didn't know any thing about it.
THE PRESIDENT: Oh, well, what is the use.
BY JUDGE MUSSMANO:
Q. Witness, were you the Chief of the SS Main Economic and Administrative Office?
A. Yes.
Q. Well, I am a little perplexed to reconcile the statement in this letter with your statement that you knew nothing about this transaction. Now, Himmler specifically states in this very document, "The Chief of the SS Main Economic and Administrative Office, in agreement with the Chief of the Security Police and SD, suggests the establishment of collective Camps for children and adolescents in Lublin," which would indicate that you were the moving factor. Is that correct or not?
A. No.
Q. Then Himmler erred in that statement? He made a mistake when he stated that?
A. I did not suggest that.
Q. Well then, Himmler was wrong.
A. I did not suggest that. Then Himmler must have been wrong.
BY DR. SEIDL:
Q. I shall now proceed to Document NO-1523, Document Book 12, on page 56 of the English document book, and Page 43 of the German document book. This was introduced by the Prosecution as 343.
THE PRESIDENT: 342.
DR. SEIDL: 342, yes, your Honors, I am sorry.
Q. (By Dr. Seidl): It deals with the assignment of inmates in the armament industry. This is a circular letter of Amt-Chief D, of the 20th of January, 1943, signed by Gluecks, and I shall quote literally from this letter.
"The attached copy is sent for your information. As I have already pointed out, every means must be used to lower the death rate in the camp.
"Full utilization and tasty preparation of the rations at hand, as well as the increased reception of parcels make this perfectly possible.
"I hold the Camp Commandant and the Chief of the Camp Administration personally responsible of the prisoners. In connection with opinions on personnel qualifications to be given by me, I shall in future examine whether the responsible SS leaders have satisfactorily fulfilled their duty in this matter too." End quotation.
I ask you now, Witness, were the concentration camps run on the same line as you were pursuing as Chief of the Main Office in connection with your functions as leader of the labor assignment?
A. Yes.
Q. Then I shall proceed to Document NO-2141, Document Book No. 12, on page 59 of the English and 47 of the German document book. It was introduced as Prosecution Exhibit 344, and it is a letter of the Chief of the Security Police and the SD to the competent agencies of the Security Service, of the 30th of March, 1943, and refers to State Police measures against Russian prisoners of war.
I ask you now, witness, do you know anything about the contents of this letter, and was the inspector of the concentration Camps immediately advised as to that letter?
A. I couldn't tell that today exactly. According to the distribution it was sent to Amtsgruppe D, immediately.
Q. And the order apparently was made from there, the order to the concentration camp commandants; as results from the distributor, Amtsgruppe D was already given twenty copies at the same time, is that correct?
A. Yes.
Q. The Prosecution introduced as Exhibit 346 a ordinance of the OKW of the 8th of July, 1943, which deals with labor for the coal mines. This is Document NO-1738, Document Book No. 12, on page 63 of the English. I ask you, witness, do you know anything about this OKW order?
A. I cannot recall exactly. However, it is possible that this decree came to me also. It is addressed to the Reichsfuehrer-SS and Chief of the German Police, it is possible that it was forwarded on.
Q. Then I shall proceed to Document NO-485, which is on page 70 of the English document book, No. 12, and on page 58 of the German document book. It was introduced by the Prosecution as Exhibit 347, and is a letter of the SS and police leader in Lublin to the personal staff of the Reichsfuehrer of the 21st of June, 1943. This letter deals with the seating up of work camps to utilize Jewish labor. Globocnik complains in this letter about the fact that orders are missing or are lacking due to lack of collaboration with the armament inspectorate. I ask you now, witness, what do you know about this matter, and what can you say about the letter itself on the basis of your own knowledge?
A. I know that Globocnik in Lublin and surroundings set up a number of labor camps and installations which he conducted as Monopol enterprises and which later on were incorporated into the Osti, O-s-t-i. I also heard that while taking care of these enterprises he had difficulties which resulted from the somewhat muddled armament conditions in the government in general. I have no further statements in reference to this letter.
Q. Then I shall proceed to document NO-1247 which is on page 88 of the English document book No. 12, and page 88 of the German also. This was introduced as Prosecution Exhibit 349. This is a letter of Office D-I to the Camp commandants on the 20th of August, 1943, and it deals with labor assignments for Jews in the occupied eastern territories. Did you participate in issuing this regulation which is contained in this document?
A. No, I did not participate in this decree.
BY THE PRESIDENT:
Q. Did you ever see it before; did you get a copy of it?
A. It is possible that I saw it. However, I couldn't recall exactly.
Q. Well, a copy was sent to the SS main Offices. Did that reach you?
A. It may be possible that I saw it, out generally speaking I have not very much to do, and nothing directly to do with the labor assignment in the eastern territories, because that was for the higher SS and police leader. I was only interrogated later on. However, it can be assumed that I saw it at the time. I am not quite sure about that.
Q. Then I shall proceed to a series of documents which are contained in Document Book No. 11 of the Prosecution. As Exhibit 350 the Prosecution introduced some correspondence which deals with the transfer of prisoners to the Reichsleiter Amann. This is Document NO-567, Document Book No. 13, and it is on page 1 of both the English and German copies.
I ask you, witness, what were the basic reasons for your opinion which can be seen from this document?
A. That, in itself, is a matter of no importance and has only been seized here because it deals with a small kommando. Generally speaking, kommandos of loss than a hundred were not to be set up.
Q. Then I shall proceed to Document NO-2164 in Document Book No. 13, on page 12 of the German and on page 13 of the English document book.
BY THE PRESIDENT:
Q. In this Document 567 you seemed to have a more intimate relation with Maurer than you have indicated in your testimony. You have told us before this that Gluecks and Maurer operated independently of you; that you did not know what they were doing; and that you had no control over them -- or little control -- and that they were responsible to Himmler and to the Secret Police. Isn't that what you said?
A. Your Honor, I always only said that in questions of labor assignments -- that is the question here -- I collaborated with Gluecks and Maurer. That was the only reason why they had been subordinated to me, and that is only where we worked. That was a question of labor assignment.
Q. I see. And this letter No. 567 has to do with labor assignments so you did speak to Maurer about that?
A. Naturally.
BY DR. SEIDL:
Q. Witness, I understand your statements so far as to the effect that Maurer -- apart from Gluecks -- was the only man, generally speaking, with whom you had any direct connection speaking of Amtsrruppe D, and that because Gruppenfuehrer Maurer was in charge of Amtsrruppe D for labor assignment.
Is that correct?
A. Yes. Maurer was the chief of Amt D-2 which was competent for labor assignment.
Q. And that fact, as shown from this document, reveals that you had close connections with him?
A. Yes. He came to see me every Friday, together with Gluecks, and we discussed questions of labor assignment. Standartenfuehrer Maurer, that is.
Q. I shall proceed to Document NO-2164, Document Book No. 13, on page 13 of the English document book, and page 12 of the German.
In connection with this document I ask you, witness, what Clearing Fund are you talking about and what was the purpose of this Clearing Fund?
A. That was a fund within the German Economic Enterprises for damages which did not have to be insured. In other words, a fund for mutual assistance of the branches which were included in the German economic enterprises.
Q. Now I shall proceed to Document NO-19-5, Document Book No. 13, on page 16 of the German, on page 18 of the English document book. It was introduced as Prosecution exhibit 353, and it is a letter which you, yourself, wrote on the 15th of January 1944, to SS-Oberfuehrer Kranefuss; and which deals with the employment of inmates in the chemical industry.
I ask you now, witness, did you take any steps yourself in order to increase the number of inmates due to the increased activity of the chemical industry; and did you approach Himmler with that matter?
A. I took no steps whatsoever in this connection. I only sent those inmates to work who were at our disposal in the concentration camps.
Q. I come now to Document NO-067, Document Book No. 13, on page 21 of the English document book and on page 19 of the German document book. The Prosecution introduced this as Prosecution Exhibit 356.