Court No. V, Case No. VII.6
A Since 1945.
Q When in 1945?
A In September 1945.
Q Where did you come from in September, 1945?
A I came from - I had been an American prisoner-of-war.
Q Where had you been as a POW?
A In France.
Q And how did you get to France?
A Shortly before the end of the war, I voluntarily went over to the Americans as a POW and was sent with a transport to France.
Q Where was that when you went over?
A That was in a small locality near Hameln on the Weser.
Q Witness, you may now take off the earphones. Would you now repeat, please?
A I became a POW on the 6th of April 1945 near Vespede--that is near Hameln on the River Weser.
Q What unit were you attached to at last?
A I was with the Pioneer Battalion 999.
Q That was a different unit from the other one that you referred to before?
A Not the same unit but the formation had the same number--999.
Q You stated, witness, that you voluntarily became a POW of the Americans?
A Yes.
Q Would you now please tell me how that happened?
A Then I must give you a somewhat lengthy account.
Q As briefly as possible, please.
AAs I had been threatened with penal proceedings in my last unit on account of resistance, I escaped from that unit-
Q What unit was that?
A That was, as I emphasized, the Pioneer Battalion 999.
And in order to save myself, I went into the Westerwald. I Court No. V, Case No. VII.
must emphasize in this connection that this unit at that time was committed in the sector Remagen, Coblenz/Weisser Turm and Mainz for construction work or rather for digging trenches in the front area. I then was living in the Westerwald for a few weeks and tried to get to my home town of Hanover, but I soon realized that this was not possible. But as the Allied Forces were advancing and I came to the town of Bad Ems, the hospital there was being dissolved I was forced to go to that hospital as I once again suffered from an attack of malaria and because of the situation there the doctor gave me a certificate of transfer to the Hanover Hospital; by virtue of this certificate I was able to travel by train and get to Hanover because I had no other papers, merely papers which showed my membership to the 999th Division, and that would have meant the end for me. When I arrived in Hanover I went to my parents, stayed there for a few days for the Allies were advancing. They were coming closer. The SS was roaming through all the villages and localities, killing and murdering soldiers that were not with their units and I thought it more expedient to go there as soon as possible in order not to fall a victim to the inhumane methods of the SS.
Thus, I went from the small locality where my parents were living, that is Eldersen near Hannover to Hameln.
Q To Hameln?
A To Hameln.
Q What was that?
A On the 6th of April, 1945.
Q Witness, you stated that you were afraid of being punished and that was the reason for your flight. What did you think-what charges would be leveled against you if you had remained with your unit?
A With this last unit I also did what I have always been doing--being an anti-Fascist and a fighter against Fascism. In this unit also, I worked with people in order to hasten the end of the war, Court No. V, Case No. VII.
to contribute to that end, and that had come to the knowledge of my superiors. I was hospitalized on account of malaria and there one day I was told by a friend of mine, a civilian, that I ought not to return to my unit because a summary court martial proceedings would be taken against me.
Q I would like to know, witness, what you did. I mean in a detailed way. What were the charges against you? What could have been the charges against you?
AAs I said-
Q And what form did your activity take?
A I talked to comrades who belonged to that unit and who were politically reliable and I gathered them together and we held conferences and discussions as to the extent to which we could contribute to the hastening of the war and how to be able to cope with the situation. I think that according to the regulations prevailing at the time, there would already have been much more than sufficient a reason for summary court martial proceedings at that time. An order had been issued that summary court martial might consist of an Ortsgruppenleiter, district leader. I think that is sufficient.
Q Witness, when did you leave the Peloponessus?
A I did not leave but I was arrested.
Q When was that?
A I believe it was on the 20th of August 1944, when under a certain pretext arrests were carried out on the Peloponessus among members of the 999th Unit.
Q What do you mean by certain pretext?
A The pretext was that in any company, people who had been ordered so had to report to the company commander. They were not allowed to bring along any equipment, only a spade. It was said that they had been ordered to extinguish a wood fire, a forest fire. These people were loaded onto trucks allegedly for the purpose of putting out the forest fire. I was also among them. When we came to Latta Court No. V, Case No. VII.
where the forest fire was allegedly raging, we were at once surrounded by officers, NCO's and enlisted men and privates who at the point of machine guns and hand grenades surrounded us. We were led to a cave and stripped of our clothing and received very old and worn out clothing. For three days we were there without any food, always guarded. We didn't know what would happen to us. We were in water up to our calves, our knees. There were cases of malaria, very acute cases, due to the most inhumane and brutal treatment. One day we were loaded onto a goods train or rather cattle train. These cattle trains were guarded by barbed wire.
Q. Witness, will you please stick to my question and be as concise as possible. I have asked you why you were detached and at what time you left the unit on the Peloponnes?
A. May I give an account again as to why I was taken away?
Q. I should like to know very briefly why you had to leave the unit and where you went?
A. I was detached from that unit because a few months previously I had been tried by a Court Martial, a Summary Court Martial, it was the Oberfeldgericht, the presiding judge of which was Oberfeldrichter Buschenhagen.
Q. Will you tell me when that was, witness?
A. In July and August of 1943.
Q. 1943?
A. Yes, 1943. I was standing trial because we political people had gathered together already on the Heuberg and because even in Greece we continued with out solidarity. We formed a committee which issued information and directives to those people who were in our confidence. This committee, which met frequently for conferences end of which I was also a member, was one day discovered because of a denounciation of one of our people who enjoyed the special confidence of his superiors and the committee was arrested. The judgment, the verdict of the court on the eight prisoners then on trial, was one death sentence, three jail terms of fifteen years. I also received a jail term of fifteen years, but the penalty was suspended because it was only to become effective after the end of the war, after the glorious end of the war which they were anticipating.
Q. Of those fifteen years, then you did not have to spend one day?
A. No, I did not.
Q. But, you left the Peloponnes and came to Germany?
A. Yes, that was the reason why I was arrested.
Q. And there you came to a Building Pioneer Battalion?
A. This transport consisted of about 300 prisoners. Before the departure of the transport, I should like to interpolate, the battalion commander came up to us and stated....
Q. No details, witness, I only want to know briefly why you were punished, why you came to Germany and where you came to Germany?
A. In Germany, we came first to the Troop Training Center in Baumholder....
Q. Briefly, witness.
A. Approximately half of these people were transferred to the Concentration Camp of Buchenwald, I was among them and we remained there for four days and we were then assigned again to the Building Pioneer Battalion which was set up again.
Q. One more question regarding this. Whet members did the Court Martial consist of?
A. The Court Martial or the peleponnes, consisted, as I said, of Buschenhagen, the Oberfelrichter, and if I recall correctly there were three more officers on the bench, who held the rank of Major at the very least, but I cannot say that with certainty. Then there were an associate judge of the Battalion who, however, was only a private first class.
Q. I would like to refer very briefly to your statement of yesterday; is it correct when I assert that you were moved from the Polytechniss before you completed your education, because you were considered politically unreliable?
A. Yes.
Q. When was that?
A. That was in May of 1933.
Q. In 1933 and what were the reasons for your removal from it?
A. At that time, after Hitler's seizure of power, purges were carried out at Universities, schools and so on and that was why a purge was also carried out in the Polytechnics, especially since our group was very active. We held discussions and meetings among the students, we organized such meetings, upon a basis which we thought was the ideal. We discussed matters and that was the reason probably why I was expelled from the school as well as several others.
Q. At any rate, after the advent of Hitler to power you did keep on studying, didn't you?
A. Yes, that was until May of 1933.
Q. Hitler came to power on the 30th of January?
A. Yes, as a result of the change in Government these measures were then taken in May.
Q. Witness, subsequently, you were sentenced to three years in jail, when was that?
A. In December of 1935.
Q. December, 1935?
A. Yes.
Q. And what were the reasons for the sentence?
A. The sentence was imposed on a charge of preparation for high treason by the Oberlandesgericht Hamm.
Q. And why high treason or preparation thereof?
A. After being forced to leave the Polytechnis in Freiburg, I as a resistance fight or as it is called today, as a convinced fighter for freedom and justice, I joined those people who carried on the struggle illegally and at that time I also had to live illegally. I worked in Hamburg, Hanover and Duesseldorf until 1934, in February 1935 I was arrested by the Gestapo, the Secret State Police.
Q. Witness, how did you get to Nurnberg, did you report here on your own initiative or were you requested by the Prosecution to come here?
A. The trial against these Generals I followed in the newspapers as far as our German papers very regrettably do refer to these proceedings. They don't do so enough, unfortunately, and I read the name of Felmy, etc. I wrote to the Tribunal in Nurnberg, or rather the Palace of Justice, and after a long time I received a reply, asking what I could state, what I had to testify in connection with the indictment. In this way I tried on my own to do what I thought was proper and right and I made my way here.
Q. No further questions, thank you.
THE PRESIDENT: Are there any further questions? Any members of the Tribunal?
Just for the record, Mr. Finger, did I understand you to say you wrote to the Tribunal?
THE WITNESS: Yes, I did.
THE PRESIDENT: Did you receive a letter from any member of the Tribunal?
THE WITNESS: Yes, I did, but I don't know whether it was a member of the Bench of the Tribunal.
MR. FENSTERMACHER: Your Honor, I am afraid the witness does not understand the distinction between the Office of the Chief of Counsel for War Crimes and the Tribunal.
THE PRESIDENT: I think possibly for the record some clarification should be made.
MR. FENSTERMACHER: I am willing to state for the record, if your Honor please, the letter was addressed..........withdrawn. Mr. Finger, do you recall who answered your letter?
WITNESS: Yes.
MR. FENSTERMACHER: Who was it?
WITNESS: Mr. Kaufmann, Mr. Fred Kaufmann.
MR. FENSTERMACHER: If your Honor please, this is an interrogator for the Office of the Chief of Counsel for War Crimes.
DR. LATERNSER: Witness, do you recall the address which you used in writing this letter; to whom did you address your letter?
WITNESS: I wrote to the Nurnberg Tribunal, to the Allied Military Tribunal, Nurnberg, Palace of Justice, nothing else.
DR. LATERNSER: And you do recall with certainty that you wrote to the Tribunal. There you have not made an error?
WITNESS: No.
DR. LATERNSER: Well, weren't you surprised then that the letter did reach the Prosecution? Answer yes or no, witness?
WITNESS: It is not my task to say that.
DR. LATERNSER: Are you surprised that this letter arrived at the hands of the Prosecution?
WITNESS: No, not at all.
DR. LATERNSER: No further questions.
THE PRESIDENT: If there is no further questioning, the witness may be excused.
(The witness is excused)
THE PRESIDENT: You may call your next witness.
MR. RAPP: May the Marshal of the Court be directed to call the witness, MAHLMANN?
DR. LATERNSER: If it please the Tribunal. I have an inquiry to make to the Prosecution. I want to ask whether this will be the last rebuttal witness.
MR. RAPP: Your Honor, as far as rebuttal witnesses are concerned, Finger was the last rebuttal witness. The other witnesses have been brought here for cross examination.
DR. LATERNSER: Your Honor, I want to ask further whether the rebuttal has already been concluded - that is, if no more documents will be submitted?
MR. RAPP: We have a number of documents which we would still like to present during the morning or early afternoon.
DR. LATERNSER: May I say something else regarding this point? The rebuttal, then, has not been concluded, and if we adhere very strictly to the ruling of the Court, then yesterday, for instance, I ought to have delivered my closing brief and filed it with the translation branch, so as to give them plenty of time - a fortnight. That was not possible because I cannot file my closing brief until the rebuttal has been finished.
THE PRESIDENT: You will not be required to file your closing brief until the rebuttal has been finished and the case concluded and I shall contact the translation department and the other necessary departments to see that they are given early attention when they are presented. I would like to ask, and request, and urge, that at the conclusion of all the evidence, these closing arguments be submitted to the translation department within the day--within a day, at least, following the close of the evidence. I think I can arrange so that the matters will then receive prompt attention.
DR. LATERNSER: Your Honor, we are very grateful to the Tribunal if the translation branch will be contacted so that the translations will be done in time.
THE PRESIDENT: I think arrangements can be made.
P A U L M A H L M A N N, a witness, took the stand and testified as follows:
THE PRESIDENT: The witness will rise and be sworn: "I swear by God, the Almighty and Omniscient, that I will speak the pure truth and will withhold and add nothing."
(The witness repeated the oath.)
THE PRESIDENT: You may be seated. Now, Mr. Rapp, please - we have been switching back and forth and perhaps we have not followed technically the regularity in connection with cross examination of witnesses and rebuttal; and in order that the record may show for what purpose each witness is called, if you will so state at the beginning of the interrogation?
MR. RAPP: This witness is the affiant, or an affiant, for the defendant Rendulic and it has reference to Rendulic Document Book No. 1, Rendulic Document No. 19, Exhibit No. 18. He is here for cross examination by the Prosecution.
THE PRESIDENT: Thank you.
MR. RAPP: Very well, your Honor.
CROSS EXAMINATION BY MR. RAPP:
Q Witness, you are PAUL MAHLMANN, born on the 10th of December 1892, at Gispersleben Kreis Erfurt?
A Yes.
Q What is your profession?
AAt present, no profession. Formerly, professional officer.
Q What was your last rank?
A Generalleutnant (Major General.)
Q And what type of unit did you last command?
A The 353rd Infantry Division.
Q Where?
AAt the last that was at the Rhine.
Q You gave an affidavit here which primarily cover a period you served at the Eastern Front. Did you continously, after that period, serve on the Eastern Front?
A No. In between I was in Germany, then in the West, and in between I was some of the time in Russia again.
Q Can you figure out, very shortly, how many months altogether you were in Russia?
A In Russia I was from the beginning of the Russian Campaign until May 1942; and subsequently from January 1943 to November 1943.
Q That figures out approximately to be 22 months - almost two years?
A Yes.
Q Do you remember having given an affidavit on behalf of the defendant Rendulic?
A Yes.
Q Do you remember the date you gave this affidavit?
A I think it must have been about three months ago, I believe. I don't recall the date but I think it will be on the document.
Q I appreciate that, witness, that you called my attention to that; but I still would like to find out whether or not YOU can recall it. Do you remember the month?
A Well, perhaps in October or November - that may have been at that time.
Q What time in October? The latter part of October, beginning of November, or when?
A Well, I can't say exactly when it was.
Q Did you make more than one affidavit for the defendant Rendulic?
A No. Only this one affidavit.
Q How did it come that you gave this affidavit?
A I was asked to do so by the Defense.
Q Well, tell me the nature--how you were invited to give it--I mean how did it come about?
A One day I received a letter from Defense Counsel for the General, asking whether I could recall certain incidents and whether I was in a position to comment on them and make a declaration. I replied that I could recall them and was able to make an affidavit regarding these incidents.
Q Regarding what particular incidents did Defense Counsel want to know whether you could remember them or not?
A Regarding the so-called Commissar Order. That is, as to whether I had knowledge of the Commissar Order, in what way I gained knowledge of it, and whether I had knowledge as to whether any shootings of commissars did take place.
Q And the affidavit which you wrote was the answer or the reply to Defense Counsel's inquiry, is that correct?
A Yes, that was the reply to the inquiry.
Q And what, basically, did your answer say?
A My reply was to the effect that I did know of the order but that shootings of commissars had not taken place, a), because, as far as I recall, the order was made officially known to the troop and, b), the Defense asked me from whom had received the order and I answered that I did not know who transmitted this order to me, and in what way I received it, but I supposed through usual channels. At any rate, I did not receive it from the General himself because it was not customary for Division Commanders to transmit orders to Regimental Commanders.
Q You commanded the 181st Regiment in the 52nd Infantry Division?
A Yes.
Q Do you know any of the other regimental commanders - at that time?
A Yes, I did know them, all of them.
Q Well, how many did you have, besides yourself?
A There were three Infantry Regimental Commanders and one Artillery Regimental Commander.
Q Who commanded the 205th Infantry Regiment?
AAt that time it was Colonel Reimann.
Q Have you seen him lately?
A Yes, I have.
Q When did you see him the last time?
A On Monday.
Q Where?
A In the witness house.
Q And before that - when did you see him the last time?
A Previously I saw him in Russia. It was when he left, shortly before his departure. As far as I recall, he left in January 1942 and that is when I saw him for the last time. Of course, I do not recall exactly when.
Q Did you ever, since you did not see him, have any contact with him in writing or any other way, since the time you saw him last in Russia and the time you saw him again in Nurnberg?
A No, never.
Q Did General Reimann tell you of his experiences here in the Courtroom?
A Yes, he did.
Q What did you discuss?
A He told me what he had been asked - the questions he had been asked and his replies to them.
MR. RAPP: I have no further questions, your Honor.
DR. FRITSCH (Counsel for defendant Rendulic): I have no questions to put to the witness.
THE PRESIDENT: Are there other Defense Counsel who wish to interrogate this witness? Any members of the Tribunal? The witness may be excused.
MR. FENSTERMACHER: Your Honor, may the Marshal be instructed to call the affiant, MAX PEMSEL, for cross examination?
MAX PEMSEL, a witness, took the stand and testified as follows:
THE PRESIDENT: The witness will raise his right hand and be sworn:
"I swear by God, the Almighty and Omniscient, that I will speak the pure truth and will withhold and add nothing."
(The witness repeated the oath.)
THE PRESIDENT: You may be seated.
CROSS EXAMINATION BY MR. FENSTERMACHER:
Q. Your name is MAX PEMSEL?
A. Yes.
Q. What was your last rank in the German Army?
A. Generalleutnant (Major General.)
Q. How long were you Chief of Staff to General Boehme in the Balkans?
A. Two months; that is, I am only referring to the time when I was assigned in Serbia.
MR. FENSTERMACHER: Your Honor wants the references to the affidavits?
THE PRESIDENT: The references, and that it is cross examination.
MR. FENSTERMACHER: It is cross examination, your Honor, on the affidavits in List Document Book I, on page 8 of List Document Book I, List Document No. 30, Exhibit 14; List Document No. 29, List Exhibit 62; List Document No. 32, List Exhibit 66; and in Kuntze Document Book I, Kuntze Document No. 2, Kuntze Exhibit No. 30.
BY MR. FENSTERMACHER:
Q. You were Chief of Staff, General Pemsel, to General Boehme during the months of September, October, and part of November, 1941?
A. Yes, in Serbia.
Q. Do you recall the affidavits you gave on behalf of Field Marshal List and General Kuntze?
A. Yes, I do.
Q. Do you remember the affidavit you gave on behalf of Field Marshal List in which you discussed the field of activities of Staatsrat Dr. Thurner? (This is in List Document Book I, on page 8, Your Honor. It is Exhibit List No. 14.) Do you recall that affidavit, General Pemsel?
A. Yes, I do.
Q. What was the field of activities of Dr. Thurner? Was he concerned with reprisal measures?
A. The field of activity -- as I have already stated in my affidavit -- I was the tactical Chief of the Staff of General Boehme. The sphere of Dr. Thurner did not touch my province so that, as I stated, I am not informed in detail. Thurner, as far as I remember, worked in the staff of the Plenipotentiary Commanding General and Military Commander.
Q. You talked about your sphere of activities. Did you have anything to do with reprisal measures?
A. No.
Q. Do you remember signing any orders or reports that had to do with reprisal measures?
A. Yes, some of them passed through my hands.
Q. Which ones do you remember?
A. I can't recall exactly. I do know of a reprisal measure, as stated in my affidavit. In one case, when 20 or 22 German officers and enlisted men had been assassinated in a bestial way, reprisals were exacted.
Q. That went through your hands -- the order for the execution of 2300 Serbs?
A. Yes. The order did pass through my hands but it was dealt with by the Staff of the Military Commander.
Q. Who gave the order for the execution of those 2300?
A. The order was issued by General Boehme.
DR. RAUSCHENBACH: If it please the Tribunal. I merely want to call attention to an error in translation. I do not know whether any significance can be attached to it but it just struck me. It was said that the order was dealt with by the Military Commander. The witness said by "the staff" but it was translated as "Chief of Staff".
BY MR. FENSTERMACHER:
Q. This order for the execution of....
THE PRESIDENT: Perhaps, Mr. Fenstermacher, you might present the question again, so that the record may be definitely made as this matter, and the witness's comments and answers be properly translated, if they were improperly translated before.
BY MR. FENSTERMACHER:
Q. Who dealt with the order, General Pemsel, for the execution of 2300 Serbs in reprisal for the death of 23 German soldiers -- who dealt with that?
A. It was dealt with by the staff of the CommanderSerbia; Lt. Col. Gravenhorst was the Chief.
Q. You mean that the order for the execution of 2300 was given by General Boehme and the actual details of the shooting -- the time and the place -- were arranged by Lt. Col. Gravenhorst's staff?
A. Yes, by that staff.
Q. And you passed that order on?
A. Yes I did. It went through my hands because I was tactical Chief to General Boehme. It was like this....
Q. Never mind, General Pemsel. Now, do you recall any other large retaliation measures which passed through your hands?
A. No, I do not. Major reprisal measures of that kind I do not recall. I said already that only some of them passed through my hands because that was not my province. As the Chief of the Staff reported to General Boehme directly and I was not present at those oral reports, I am not able to testify as to the details. I do know about a serious case in Kragujevac.
Q. How many persons were killed in reprisal on that occasion?
A. In Kragujevac you mean? Kragujevac, to my knowledge, as far as I was informed, was not a reprisal measure. It was an independent operation taken by the local Field Commander, he, being the territorial commander and being subordinate to the Military Commander; General Boehme, when he heard of that, in talking to me, repudiated that case in the most severe terms and initiated a court investigation. As far as I know, an officer from the staff was delegated to investigate the case.
Q. You have mentioned two reprisal measures now, General Pemsel. One that you previously had referred to in an affidavit; I think that one involved the death of 21 German soldiers of the 521st Signal Regiment and, in retaliation for their deaths, 2100 Serbs were executed. That is the first one you mentioned, isn't it?
A. Yes.
Q. And then the second one at Kragujevac. Do you know how many persons were executed on that occasion?
A. I can't say that but to my knowledge it was a great number. Perhaps I may be allowed to remark that particularly workers....
Q. Never mind, General Pemsel. If you don't remember the number that were executed, that is all we are interested in. Now you said that the first reprisal measure of 2100 Serbs did pass through your hands but the one at Kragujevac you had nothing to do with?
A. Yes.
Q. Now do you recall a third reprisal measure which took place while you were in Serbia, as Chief of Staff to General Boehme?
A. Not any major case.
Q. So the only one you do remember is the execution of 2100 Serbs in reprisal for the death of the 21 members of the 521st Signal Regiment?
A. Yes.
Q. Will you please look at this document, General Pemsel. (This is NOKW -560. It was introduced into evidence by the Prosecution as Prosecution Exhibit 84. It is in Prosecution Document Book III, on page 22.) Is that your signature on that document, General Pemsel?
A. I cannot recognize it...Yes.
Q. Well, that document refers to the death of 220 arrested Serbs in retaliation for 10 killed and 24 wounded German soldiers - members of the troop units seized in Valjevo. You do not remember that retaliation measure?
A. No, I do not.
Q. Is the death of 220 Serbs a rather unimportant detail for you to remember?
A. I can't recall this case.
Q. General Pemsel, after you left the Balkans, where did you go?
A. From the Balkans I was transferred to Norway.
Q. During the evacuation of the Northern Norwegian province of Finmark you were Commander of the Sixth Mountain Division under the 20th Mountain Army which was commanded by General Rendulic, weren't you?
A. Yes.
THE PRESIDENT: We will take our morning recess at this time.
(A recess was taken.)