A. Well, I wanted to drive them back home.
Q. Did you do that?
A. Yes.
Q. Then did you talk, meet another American soldier in the village?
A. Yes, before I got home I met another American.
Q. What did he say to you?
A. I had to load up munition.
Q. And then?
A. And then he let me go again.
Q. And then what happened? Where did you go then?
A. Then I went home and then I was stopped by another American.
Q. And what did he say to you?
A. He led me to the corpse.
Q. Which corpse?
A. The corpse of an American.
Q. That did he do there when you were there? I mean this American soldier?
A. He said to me, "That is an American. Do you understand?" and I said "Yes," and then he said," He was shot by a German soldier," and I said, "I don't know anything about it."
Q. And then what did the American say to you, when you said that you didn't know anything about it?
A. "You all know; the whole village knows." The village, and then he again made the same action with a match.
Q. Did he actually light a match?
A. Yes, he struck and lighted a match.
Q. What did you do then?
A. Then I wanted to go home again, the other Americans came with evacuees and they took me along again with them.
Q. Where to?
A. Back again to the dead American.
Q. What did you have to do there?
A. I had to look at the dead American again and then he said exactly the same thing.
Q. What do you mean, "The same thing"?
A. German soldier shot him; village will be set on fire.
Q. And then what was done to you?
A. Then I went home.
Q. And then did you arrive home.
A. No. I did not arrive -
Q. But?
A. The inn keeper came and she took me back to her house and she said, "You are to be shot." And then I went along with her and then we had to wait until the Americans came. We were supposed to wait until the Americans came. And then they took us back again to the dead man.
Q. And then what happened to all the men in the village?
A. The men were lined up at the street.
Q. All the men in the village?
A. Yes, all the men in the village except two.
Q. Were you guarded?
A. Yes, we were guarded.
Q. Where were all the men in the village? Where were they?
A. They were standing in the street.
Q. In the village or outside the village?
A. Outside the village, in the street.
Q. And who guarded them?
A. American soldiers, with machine guns, around them.
Q. And then what did you see, from where you were?
A. The village was set on fire.
Q. And then what happened to the village?
A. The village was burned to the ground.
Q. Completely burned to the ground?
A. Yes, I saw no house standing. That is, I saw one house standing.
Q. That is everything was burned except one house?
A. Yes.
Q. And to whom did this house belong?
A. This house belonged to Kaiser.
Q. And then what did you do when you were able to get away from this collection place?
A. We wanted to try and put out the fire, but we couldn't get in.
Q. Who stopped you from putting the fire out?
A. Also American soldiers.
Q. Did you try to put the fire out?
A. I tried later on, perhaps around about one o'clock.
Q. About when was the village set on fire?
A. Perhaps about eight o'clock.
Q. And then where did you go, when you were no longer guarded?
A. I went to Dalohn and then I asked where I could find some lodgings for my family.
Q. And when did you come back again?
A. Perhaps about one o'clock.
Q. And then what did you do, at one o'clock?
A. -- I tried to put the fire out and then I was shot at twice.
Q. By whom?
A. By Americans.
A. Were you able to put the fire out?
A. No, I was not able to put the fire out.
Q. Was everything you possessed burned out?
A. Yes.
Q. And what happened to the other inhabitants?
A. The same thing happened to all the other inhabitants.
DR. LATERNSER: I have no further questions.
JUDGE BURKE: Have any other defense attorneys any questions?
Apparently Not. Mr. Fulkerson, you may proceed.
CROSS EXAMINATION BY MR. FULKERSON:
Q Can you hear all right now?
A Yes.
Q You will have to excuse me for my ignorance of geography, but exactly where is Pfeffershofen?
A It is eight kilometers from Neumarkt in the direction towards Amberg.
Q Is that in Westphalia, or where?
A No, it is in the Upper Palatinate (Oberpfalz).
Q Now, you say that on the 18th of April the American troops came in for the first time.
A Yes.
Q And then they were driven back?
A No, they weren't driven back.
Q But they withdrew in any event?
A Yes, they withdrew into the next village.
Q And then the next visitors you had were the SS?
A Yes, but the Americans came again on the next day.
Q Now from what direction did the SS come?
A The SS came from Dachenhofen over the fields.
Q Was this an SS infantry outfit?
A I don't know. It was only a reconnaissance car.
Q You say that the barns were burned down at that time?
A One barn.
Q Why?
A The SS opened fire.
Q On whom?
A Well, they simply opened fire in the village.
Q Well, didn't they have any particular target? They didn't just ride into the village and start firing indiscriminately, did they?
A They shot all around and in the village.
Q You mean they were shooting at Germans?
A Well, I don't know what they were shooting at at all. The Americans were not inside and they just shot around the whole village.
Q Did this shooting of theirs cause any fires in the village?
A Yes, one barn was burned down.
Q How big is the village.
A There are fourteen farmers in the village.
Q That is, fourteen dwellings altogether?
A Yes, and adjoining buildings, auxiliary buildings.
Q Fourteen buildings altogether?
A No, dwelling houses with auxiliary buildings and barns.
Q Well, how many dwelling houses are there?
A Fourteen dwelling houses.
Q Now how long did the SS stay there?
A The SS were there perhaps not even half an hour; perhaps ten minutes.
Q Do you know whether they all withdrew, or did some of them stay behind?
A I don't know how many there were altogether, but there was just a reconnaissance car, and then I didn't see anything else.
Q Now then, the next day you say the Americans came back?
A Yes.
Q And when was this American soldier killed? About what time was that?
A Well, we didn't know. We thought perhaps that took place during the shooting when the SS were there.
Q You mean that the SS did not withdraw until the Americans actually came into the town?
A They didn't come into the village at all. They were outside the village.
Q The Americans were outside the village? Or the SS?
A The Americans were outside the village and the SS- they were outside the local Pub, and that is on the road which runs along the village.
Q But there was an exchange of shooting between the American troops and the SS troops very near the village? If not inside it?
A Yes. Yes. It was quite near to the village.
Q And the houses were set on fire by this?
A Yes.
Q How many?
A Well, no house was set on fire. The barn was set on fire.
Q And then after this exchange of shooting between the SS and the Americans, the Americans withdrew -- the SS withdrew and the Americans came in to the village?
A No, they didn't get into the village either.
Q Well, they must have got in it at sometime. You say they burned it down. Now when did they get into it.
A That was the next day in the early morning.
Q Oh, I see. This exchange of shooting -- this exchange of shots took place on the 19th.
A That was on Friday the 20th. On the 18th they came, that was Wednesday, and then Thursday was the 19th and Friday was the 20th, and then on the 21st they set the village on fire.
Q On what day was it that you were shown this dead American soldier?
A That was on Saturday in the early morning.
Q What date?
A That was the 21st.
Q Did you have any idea how long this man had been dead? How long it had been since he was killed?
A Well, he must have been killed quite recently because the skull -- half the skull was missing.
Q Did you know where he was killed? Where he was standing or sitting at the time he was killed? Where?
A Well, right on the spot. Here was a pool of blood. This was outside the village, about 100 meters outside the village.
Q How had he been killed. Was it by a rifle shot or grenade or what?
A Well, I don't know. I think it was through a rifle butt, because half of the skull was missing.
Q And the SS at that time had completely withdrawn from the village?
A Yes, they had returned to Berghofen.
Q Yes, but at the time this American soldier was killed on the 21st, there were no SS troops in the village at that time?
A No, I didn't see anymore of them.
Q Were there any other German troops in the locality? Were there any other German troops?
A Further away. For instance in Berghofen; that is about three-quarters of an hour away. There were German troops still there.
Q About the time that this American soldier was killed in the square there were no SS troops in the village so far as you know, and no German troops?
A No, the SS troops were never in the village at all, but about two days before the Americans arrived the Germans had already withdrawn.
Q Were any other American soldiers killed in the village that day or the day before?
A No, not one shot was fired.
Q I believe that is all.
REDIRECT EXAMINATION BY DR. LATERNSER:
Q I think that there is rather a mix-up. When did the Americans come to Pfeffershofen for the first time?
A That was on Wednesday, the 18th of April.
Q Was there fighting for Pfeffershofen?
A No.
Q What did the Americans troops do? The ones who arrived on the 18th?
A. They were about 1½ or 2hours there; they ate, they even cooked in my place, and then they went away again.
Q When did they come for the next time?
A That was on the next day, the 19th.
Q On the next day was there fighting for the village?
A No, there was also no fighting.
Q And then they withdrew again?
A Yes, they withdrew again.
Q That was on the 19th of April?
A Yes.
Q Then what happened on the 20th of April?
A On the 20th of April none of them came at all.
Q But who came?
A When it was dark, SS came.
Q Was that a formation or just one car?
A That was just one car.
Q And were they inside the village?
A No, they were not inside the village.
Q But what did they do?
A They were on the road near the Pub -- the Inn.
Q Is the inn outside the village?
A It is about fifty meters away from the last house in the village.
Q And then what did the SS car do? Did it shoot?
A Yes, they opened fire and shot around the village.
Q Do you mean they shot over the village or around the village?
A They shot over the village and around the village.
Q Well, what did they shoot with?
A Well, they shot with machine guns.
Q And how was the barn belonging to Farmer Strobel set on fire.
A It was set on fire by the SS shooting.
Q That was the 20th of April, 1945?
A Yes.
Q Now, let's turn to the 21st of April. Was there shooting in the 21st of April?
A No, there was no shooting on the 21st of April.
Q But when did the Americans come?
A The Americans came in the early morning; perhaps about seven o'clock.
Q And was there fighting for this village?
A No, there was no fighting.
Court No. V, Case No. VII.
Q Well, how did the people think that this American soldier was killed?
A Well, we thought that he had been killed by the SS.
Q And when was the SS there?
A The SS were there in the evening.
Q On the 20th of April?
A Yes, on the 20th of April. Friday.
Q Where was the dead American soldier lying?
A The dead American soldier was lying about one hundred meters outside the village.
Q On the 20th of April did the SS car shoot in that direction?
A I was not in the village, but they shot around the village.
Q Did this SS car shoot with tracer ammunition?
A Yes, with tracer ammunition.
Q Did you see that yourself?
A Yes, because we had to take shelter, we were outside the village and took shelter.
Q I have no further questions.
RECROSS EXAMINATION BY MR. FULKERSON:
Q When the Americans burned the village down, as you say, how did they do it? By firing on the houses?
A No, they just set them on fire.
Q They moved all the people out of them?
A Yes.
Q And then set them on fire. Did they set them on fire individually?
A Yes. Yes.
Q All except one, you say.
A Yes, except the house of Kaiser.
Q That is all.
DR. LATERNSER: I have no further questions to the witness. I Court No. V, Case No. VII.
would now like to call the next witness. This is the witness Kaiser.
JUDGE BURKE: The witness may be excused.
DR. RAUSCHENBACH: Dr. Rauschenbach for the defendant Foertsch. Your Honor, might I take this opportunity to protest against the application of the Prosecution to cross examine the affiant von Harling. I have submitted two affidavits by von Harling in my Document Book 2. The affidavits were accepted without objection and now in my opinion things are as follows: If a witness is excused, then the other side must immediately cross examine him. If the witness has left the court room and a long period has elapsed, then the idea can not suddenly arise that he should be cross examined. The same thing happens in the case of an affidavit and in this instance I would like to refer to the practice which has been followed up to now before the Nuernberg Military Tribunals. If an affiant who had given an affidavit was to be requested for cross examination, then the other side always moved that the affidavit was only to be admitted if the witness was brought in for cross-examination. But this did not happen in this case, but the Prosecution comes after almost four months with the request for the witness von Harling to be cross examined here.
THE PRESIDENT: When was this affidavit filed?
DR. RAUSCHENBACH: It was submitted while the defendant Foertsch was in the witness stand, which was in the middle of October. If necessary, I can find the exact date. It was between the 13th and 17th of October; that is almost three months have passed since.
MR. FENSTERMACHER: I would just like to make a short answer to this objection. During the course of this trial the defendants have introduced into evidence more than 1500 affidavits. We, of course, could not apply to have each and every one of these affiants brought to Nuernberg for cross-examination, so we decided to bring a representative number, perhaps one or two from each defendant. I think we have applied for not more than fifteen, which would certainly be not more than one per cent of the total number of affidavits Court No. V, Case No. VII.
introduced by the defendants. In order that we bring the proper affiants to Nuernberg and not waste our time, the defense' time and the Tribunal's time, we had to be very careful about those whom we did select. We certainly couldn't be expected to select the representative affiants until the defendants had finished and completed each of their cases. None of the cases was completed and finished until this morning. I submit we could not be expected to submit the names of those affiants we wanted brought to Nurnberg for cross-examination prior to today.
THE PRESIDENT: I take it, Mr. Fenstermacher, that this will be the only request for witnesses, or will there be a further request?
MR. FENSTERMACHER: There will be no further application by the Prosecution.
THE PRESIDENT: The ruling that the Tribunal previously made will be adhered to unless on examination we find that the same should be changed. For the present it will stand.
DR. LATERNSER: I would now like to call the witness Joseph Kaiser.
JOSEPH KAISER, a witness, took the stand and testified as follows:
BY JUDGE BURKE:
Q Will the witness raise his right hand and be sworn?
I swear by God the Almighty and Omniscient that I will speak the pure truth and will withhold and add nothing. (The witness repeated the oath.)
JUDGE BURKE: You may be seated.
DIRECT EXAMINATION BY DR. LATERNSER:
Q Will you please state your full name to the Tribunal?
A My name is Joseph Kaiser, farmer in Pfeffershofen.
Q How long have you been in Pfeffershofen?
A I was born in Pfeffershofen, House No. 8, and I am 52 years old.
Court No. V, Case No. VII.
Q That is, you have spent your whole life in Pfeffershofen?
A Yes, with the exception of five years in the Army; otherwise, I spent my whole life in Pfeffershofen.
Q Herr Kaiser, when I ask you a question, please make a little pause because my questions have to be translated into English.
A Yes, Herr Doctor. I will do that.
Q When did the American troops come to Pfeffershofen?
A The American troops came on Wednesday, the 18th of April, around about twelve until one o'clock. Twelve to one.
Q Did the Americans stay on this day in Pfeffershofen?
A No, they only stayed around about mid-day for about an hour, and then they drove off again.
Q What happened on the next day?
A On the next day one car drove around and round, but otherwise we didn't see anything.
Q What happened on Friday the 20th?
A On Friday the 20th one car drove around about noon time, and then when it was dark firing started and the people said that there was a German tank behind the inn and that it was firing with tracer ammunition into and around the village.
Q Mr. Kaiser, you must speak a little slower. What happened on that evening when this German tank fired?
A Well, on this evening when the German tank started firing, a barn right in the middle of the village was set on fire by the shooting, and I called the people of my fire brigade staff to try and put the fire out.
Q Well, then when the barn was on fire, did you put the fire out?
A Yes, I and all my young helpers, we tried to put the fire out.
Court No. V, Case No. VII.
Q And you were able to do that?
A Well from nine to eleven o'clock we fought the fire and about eleven o'clock the barn fell to pieces, I posted a fire guard there and then we went home again, went to bed.
Q How long did this firing take place?
A Well, the firing went on for about six or seven minutes, not quite ten minutes.
Q And that was Friday the 20th of April?
A Yes, in the evening.
Q Well then, what happened on the next day--on the 21st?
A On the 21st, Saturday, in the morning shortly before seven o'clock, American troops came and tanks came rolling in.
Q Just a minute. Did they occupy Pfeffershofen, after fighting or was there no fighting?
A Without a fight. Not one single shot was fired.
Q When was the only time when shooting took place?
A Only on Friday in the night about nine o'clock for six or seven minutes.
Q On Saturday the 21st no shooting took place at all?
A No shooting at all, except a few intimidation shots which the Americans fired on the civilian population.
Q And against whom was this intimidation shooting carried out?
A Well-
Q We will come to your answer to that in a minute. You say they fired on civilians?
A Well, of course, because there weren't any soldiers there.
Q Well, what was the strength of the American troops?
A Well, I saw about three platoons, about 60 to 80 men and then the tanks came in and-
Q Well now, really, Herr Kaiser, you must speak a little bit slower. What was the strength of the American troops who occupied the village on Saturday?
Court No. V, Case No. VII.
A Wall, the troops--there were three platoons with not quite a hundred men, 70 or 80 men and about 30 or more cars.
Q Well then, what did the troops do?
A Well they came into the village and there were about ten to fifteen men to each farm and then the tanks rolled through the village and then encircled the village and in the fields and in the meadows.
THE PRESIDENT: Pardon me, please. We will take our afternoon recess at this time.
(A recess was taken.)
Court No. V, Case No. VII.
THE MARSHAL: Persons in the courtroom will please find their seats.
The Tribunal is again in session.
THE PRESIDENT: Pardon me, Dr. Laternser, before you continue the examination of this witness, the Tribunal wishes to call to the attention of all counsel that during the recess period there was presented to the Tribunal a notice filed on behalf of the prosecution which was dated January 10, 1948, but which only reached our office prior to the recess period in which the prosecution demands the following affiants be called for cross-examination:
1. Karl Heinz Rothfuchs 2. Ernst Strassl 3. Col.
Paul Nahlmann 4. Helmuth Reymann 5. Prinz Friedrich-Ferdinand-von Schleswig-Holstein-Glueckberg 6. Max Pemsel 7. Hans Harold von Selchow 8. Walter Warlimont 9. Willy Zorn 10.
August Winter.
11. Hermann Hoth 12.
Hans Reinhardt It is the ruling of the Tribunal that these witnesses and affiants may be called for cross-examination in keeping with our previous announced ruling in connection with the two prior affiants the application concerning whom was commented upon earlier this afternoon.
You may proceed with your direct examination.
DIRECT EXAMINATION (Continued) BY DR. LATERNSER:
Q Herr Kaiser, we were talking about the morning of 21st of April when the American troops came into Pfeffershofen. Where was the front line at the time? Were the villages in the vicinity already Court No. V, Case No. VII.
occupied?
A No, the neighboring villages were not yet occupied but a part of the troops were concentrated about three-quarters of an hour away in a place called Bergenhofen and they were digging fox holes there, but they were not successful.
Q What did the American troops do when they occupied the village on the 21st of April--that is the village of Pfeffershofen?
A In every farm there were about 15 to 20 men and they came to every farmstead. They invaded them up to the barn and they set fire to it and the bulk of the troops went into the dwelling houses and took the civilian population along the main road, marched them out onto the main road. And of course when the population was being marched off the barns were already aflame.
Q What did the Americans do in the houses?
A They were setting fire to the houses mostly from the bottom upwards, and that is what they did with the barns.
Q How did this go along? Did they open the doors and windows?
AAll the doors and windows were wide open.
Q How was it in your own house?
A In my house,--with a cart loaden with linen, my belongings and sick persons, I came around the house. I was supposed to go to the main road but I saw that the advancing armored cars were coming through the village and ran over a cow, so I said "Nothing doing" and I went away and went around to my dwelling house and went around the burning barn-
Q Always make a pause so that the translation can follow your answer; so you didn't go to the assembly center where the other population was assembled but you went into the woods, did you?
A Yes, when they wanted to lead me away I said "Nothing doing" and they wanted to collect me too and the cows. Then I went around into the woods.
Q Just a moment, Mr. Kaiser. How long did you stay in the woods?
Court No. V, Case No. VII.
A I took my cart about a hundred meters away from my dwelling house and took it along and went and returned then to the dwelling house.
Q How long were you in the woods?
A The first time only ten minutes.
Q Where did you go then?
A I went from the back door through the stables and to my dwelling house.
Q Just a minute -- what did you see there?
A I saw from the stable that soldiers were going through my house. I saw them walking out.
Q And what were they doing?
A To the left there was a living room where the two maids were sleeping. I saw much smoke coming out of the room, so I am that there was something on fire. I took a gas mask and some cans with water; I took everything and filled them with water. One of the maids was sleeping on strow, the other one had a mattress. Both beds had caught fire and also a cupboard with linen.
Q Please make a pause, Mr. Kaiser. Just a moment -- I am asking you to please answer my question: what did you see? What did you see in your barn?
A In the barn, when we left the house the barn doers were open and I and my eldest son went into the barn. We saw that American soldiers were in there. From the right side were strow was pilled up, they were going to the left side to a big haystack.
Q Just a moment, please. What actually did you see? What were the American soldiers doing?
A They had a handful of burning hay with which they sat fire to the strow, which was pilled up on the other side of the barn.
Q What else did they set fire to?
A When they saw us coming into the barn in order to take everything out the machinery etc, they came down the stairs and ordered us to get out, pushed us out.
Q Just a moment, what else did the American soldiers set aflame?
A I saw how they took everything, how they took the threshing machines out and how they set them on fire.
Q Just a moment. How many children do you have?
A I have ten children -- seven boys and three girls.
Q What did you say to the American soldiers who were setting fire to your barn? Just a moment please -- that has to be translated first.
A When they set fire to the barn. I did not say anything because it would have been in vain. But when they sat the fire to the dwelling house .....
Q I would ask you once again, to make a pause; the translator cannot follow you. Please speak more slowly and, having finished a sentence, make a brief pause.
What did you tell the American soldiers who were setting fire to your dwelling house?
A I asked them with tears in my eyes not to set fire to the dwelling house because I have ten children and the stables and all the animals and there were young calves and it was raining and cold.
Q Just a moment witness.
A Everything was burning already and I asked them as least not to set fire to my dwelling house.
Q What did the American soldiers say to you?
A There was only one of them among the five; he was laughing at me and mocking me and he said everything was to be "kaputt."
Q Now, when they had said that were you allowed to remain in the house?
A No, they took me by the scruff of my neck and carried me out and when I went there was a shot fired behind me. It must have been just a shot in order to frighten me.
Q And why was not your house burned down?
A It was set on fire in two different places, but I put the fire out immediately. You see, I am very well versed in this; I have been the leader of our fire-brigade for ten years and so I knew how to put out a fire.