(Dr. Laternser) With the establishment of the Sabac Camp, Field Marshal List, as I will show from Prosecution documents, had nothing to do, so far as this camp was concerned.
I am going to read from List Document No. 207, this has already been submitted as Exhibit No. 82, and I would like to read another passage from this document. It is contained in Document Book 5, page 58. I read from the middle of the page:
"IV. Prisoners.
1.) Detained persons:
In Sabac, at present approximately 20,000. These will be screened by a court martial attached to the Acting Commanding General in Serbia, in conjunction with police and Security Service of the Military Government, for possible membership in bandit groups or the Communist Party. Some of them have been detailed to working detachments. They will be released pursuant to the orders issued by the Military Commander Southeast, after they have been screened.
Signed "Signature illegible, General Staff Captain."
The order quoted here is Prosecution's Exhibit No. 70, which is contained in Document Book 2, of the Prosecution, page 141. From this document, Exhibit 82, I would like to read another passage on page 57. This concerns the question of the deportation of the people from the Save-Drina river bond: "To the Plenipotentiary Commanding General in Serbia:
Headquarters." It is dated 2 October 1941, and I skip the bit in the middle and read from Figure 1:
"Following instructions from higher quarters the evacuation of the noncombatant population of the Save-Drina bend to the south was not affected."
With regard to the alleged Camp of Save-Drina, which was ordered by General Boehma, in his order dated the 6th of October, Prosecution Exhibit No, 71, Document Book 2 of the Prosecution, page 143, in this connection too, I would like to submit a document. It is List Document No. 206, which become Exhibit No. 101.
This document is contained in Document Book 5, page 54. This is an excerpt from the War Diary of Headquarters XVIIIth Corps and I read from page 55, a brief passage:
"28 October 1941.
Discussion with commanding officer of transient prisoner camp 183: Camp Zasavica unusable because of miring of territory following flooding. Commanding General orders that in lieu of the Zasavica concentration camp the exhibition territory Semlin is to be completed. Commanding officer of transient prisoner camp 183 instructed to discontinue the completion of Zasavica concentration camp, to return prisoners to collecting camp Sabac."
The Prosecution further asserted that the systematic prosecution of the Jews was carried out by the Wehrmacht. The attitude of Field Marshal List to the Jewish question, and at all times, the facts refute this assertion. As proof of General Field Marshal List's attitude toward the Jewish question I now submit document, List No. 7. which becomes Exhibit No. 102. This document you will find in Document Book 2, page 52. This is an affidavit by Colonel Dyes:
"Effective from 8 4- 38 I was transferred from the office of Regiment Adj. in infantry regiment 16 Oldenburg, to the office of Major on the staff of the Army Group Command V in Vienna, the Commander in Chief of which was the then Major General List. I was subordinate to the Chief of the general staff, the then General Ruoff, and had direct access to him and to the Supreme Commander."
MR. FULKERSON: I object to this document, if Your Honors please, first because it is not relevant, there is nothing said in here that has to do with what happened during the period covered by the Indictment. If we went into all of the matters discussed here it would take us even further afield than we have gone already, by several years.
The documents contain -- the affidavit, so-called, contains, no sort of preamble saying that it is given under oath or in lieu of oath.
I believe that is enough for the moment.
DR. LATERNSER: With regard to the proper swearing of this document, the signature is certified by our notary and this is in accordance with the provisions; with regard to the contents, I am going to prove that a man who at all times had the attitude of a decent, humane being toward the Jewish question, cannot be assumed to have prosecuted the Jews without the Prosecution bringing further details with regard to it.
THE PRESIDENT: You may complete your sentence.
DR. LATERNSER: The attitude during the whole period is important. I maintain that at all times Field Marshal List had a decent attitude towards the Jewish question so that he could never have done what the Prosecution has charged against him.
THE PRESIDENT: From a hurried study of this particular affidavit it is apparent that most of it is applicable to a time prior to the time in controversy.
It seems to me that the objection should be sustained.
DR. LATERNSER: The next document I would like to submit is Document List No. 141. This become Exhibit No. 103. I am sorry, 102. This is to be found in Document book 2, page 56. It is an affidavit by Major von Haehling, and I would like to read it.
MR. FULKERSON: Before he reads it I would like to make the same objection to this affidavit that I just interposed to the last one. That is, that the time covered here is outside of the scope of the indictment.
DR. LATERNSER: Your Honors, in this connection I would like to say that this affidavit concerns official presentations which Field Marshal List made in 1938, against these excesses which were undertaken at the time against Jewish businesses. This was at a time when although ever decent German did not agree with these excesses, it was terribly difficult to make official representations against them.
And for the rest, the Prosecution itself in examination, again and again questioned about the general attitude of the defendants to the Jewish question, and I am just presenting supplementary evidence to this effect.
THE PRESIDENT: The objection will be sustained.
DR. LATERNSER: The next document I would like to submit is List No. 7 and this receives Exhibit No. ;02. It is contained in List Document Book 2, page 54. It is an affidavit by Otto Voehler containing the same point, and which I cannot submit.
No. 102 is now given to List Document No. 49. This is contained in List document book 2, page 58, and it is an affidavit by General Woehler It is page 58.
THE PRESIDENT: Prior to our morning recess the Tribunal wishes to announce that it has filed this morning, an order of severance of the defendant von Weichs. This statement is made into the record for the information of all concerned.
You may have some opportunity during this recess period to check on some other affidavits that may have the same questions, that we have just been considering, and if you will do that it may save us some later time.
The Tribunal will be in recess for fifteen minutes.
(Tribunal in recess until 1115 hours.)
THE MARSHAL: Persons in the Courtroom will please take their seats.
The Tribunal is again in session.
THE PRESIDENT: You may proceed.
DR. LATERNSER: The next document will be Exhibit 102.
MR. FULKERSON: I should like to make the same objection as I did with regard to the other two. This one also covers the time outside the period included in the indictment.
DR. LATERNSER: It concerns events during the whole of the Polish campaign in which Fieldmarshal List had to take stringent measures against excesses. The Prosecution has during the interrogation of the defendant questioned him about his attitude towards the Jewish question. When it was the prosecution's turn, they thought this point was important. Now that it is the defense's turn, they don't think this point of the indictment is not important any longer. I cannot deal with only the events in the Balkans but I have to submit evidence for the general attitude displayed by Fieldmarshal List on this subject.
THE PRESIDENT: What is the page number and the document number?
DR. LATERNSER: Document Book II, page 58.
THE PRESIDENT: This appears to concern the Polish campaign, as I observe it.
DR. LATERNSER: May it please the Tribunal, I wanted to show the general attitude displayed by Fieldmarshal List. The prosecution maintainedthey asserted a plan concerning the systematic persecution of the Jews. If such a plan really existed, then such a plan had existed previously. That is why I take the point of view of the prosecution.
THE PRESIDENT: The objection will be sustained.
DR. LATERNSER: The next document submitted will be Document List 138 to be Exhibit 102. It is contained in Document Book II, page 45. It is an affidavit by Hermann Haack. I am reading from the second paragraph:
"From the entry into Greece of the German troops till end of September 1942 I was army intendant at 12th Army H.Q.
In the summer of 1941 the Jewish question, so far as I know, was of no importance to the 12th Army High Command and the Commander-in-Chief South East. Whether it was of any importance in Serbia I do not know.
In my sphere of activity which covered in particular the procuring of food supplies for the army, the 12th Army made contracts with Jewish firms regarding the delivery of foodstuffs. I cannot remember particulars, such as the names of the suppliers.
Such a method of placing orders was quite in keeping with the intentions of Field Marshal-General List who at all times only desired that the army should be well and regularly fed, and bothered little whether the supply contracts were made with Jewish firms.
In keeping with this principle, officers of the 12th Army in Greece, myself among them, were often billeted with Jewish families. Field Marshal General List took no exception to that, either."
The next document submitted is List 27-B. It will be Exhibit 103. It is on page 47 of the same document Book No. II. It is an affidavit by Theodor Jestrabek, of which I beg to read the second paragraph, the first two sentences.
"In 1941 I was mess officer on the staff of the then high command of 12th army. There was no such thing as a Jewish problem in Greece in the summer of 1941. On the contrary, both the army and the staff availed themselves mainly of the services of Jewish suppliers who were regarded as very reliable."
I omit the next sentence and proceed:
"As a matter of fact, in agreement with the Chief of Staff I have been dealing with Jewish suppliers for a very long time and made good experiences."
The next Document List 119--it will be Exhibit 104 and is on page 48 of Document Book II. It is an affidavit by Dr. Drexler. I shall read from the second paragraph:
"Between 6 April 1941 and 5 February 1942 I was major (medical corps) and medical officer on special assignment on the staff of 12th Army H.Q.
The Jewish question was of no importance to Field Marshal List. No orders, either in writing or orally, were ever issued aiming at the oppression, or to the prejudice, of the Jews. Not even shopping in Jewish shops was forbidden. Jewish venders who offered and sold their goods to German soldiers right in front of the staff building of the 12th Army H.Q. were not hindered."
The next document List 145 to be Exhibit 105 is on page 49 of Document Book II, an affidavit of General Serini. I shall read from the second paragraph:
"Between 7 November 1939 and 5 May 1942, I was at first lieutenant colonel and, subsequently, from 1 October 1940, colonel and first adjutant of the 12th Army.
During this period I never heard anything about the Jewish question having been of any importance in the area of the 12th Army."
The next exhibit will be List Document 20. It will be Exhibit 106. It is on page 50 of the same Document Book II. It is an affidavit by Dr. Gruen, who was Judge Advocate of the 12th Army, as will be shown by the second paragraph. I shall read the third paragraph:
"The Jewish question was of no importance in Serbia and Greece in the summer of 1941. The Wehrmacht had more important jobs on hand than the Jewish question in which it took little interest, although there were many Jews in Greece, in particular in the seaports. I have not come across a single case where Jews have been molested by the Wehrmacht during this period."
The next document will be List 39, No. 107, Exhibit 107, on page 51. It is an affidavit by Dr. Schaefer. I shall read from the second paragraph:
"At the time of the events in question I was General Staff Veterinary Surgeon and Army Veterinary Surgeon of the 12th Army. In the summer of 1941 the Jewish problem in Serbia and Greece did not concern the Army H.Q. 12, respectively, the command South East. I have no knowledge of any orders forbidding association with Jews. For instance, I lived for some time with a Jewish family in Saloniki on the best possible terms."
That Field Marshal List always displayed this attitude, that is, the attitude of a decent person regarding the Jews is proven by List Document 8, which I offer as Exhibit 108. It is on page - it is in Document Book II, on page 61. It is an affidavit by Dr. Fuernrohr:
"In cognizance of the relevant articles of the penal law I herewith make the following affidavit.
"For 37 years I have been married to a baptised Jewess, and for this reason we have been subjected to an increasing degree to the commonly known persecutions in the Third Reich. The effect was that more and more of our acquaintances, friends and also relatives did not come to our house any more and did not ask us any more to visit them.
We were impressed all the more in these days by the attitude shown towards us by Field Marshal List and his family.
"Around 1941 List had a country house built in Partenkirchen quite near to our little weekend house (which during the war we dared visit only occasionally because we were forbidden) moving in, as far as I remember, in 1942. List had heard of our difficult situation from a mutual Munich acquaintance. After they had become our neighbors, Mr. and Mrs. List (who were unknown to me up till then) sent us an invitation through the just mentioned Munich acquaintance to come around and visit them. In view of the attitude we had experienced from so many others we were exceedingly surprised at the invitation of this man in such an exposed position, although we had heard before that the List family were highly decent people and not a bit Nazi-colored. At the next opportunity we paid the requested visit and we were received in the most amiable manner by the whole family (Mr. and Mrs. List, their two daughters and two grandchildren), Mr. List's Adjutant also being present. Shortly afterwards the Lists returned our call in the most amiable manner. In the course of time we met occasionally in the street and I was several times addressed by Field Marshal General List who inquired warmly how things had fared with us.
"I am not in any way related to Mr. or Mrs. List. I belong to those persons not affected by the denazification law. I am ready at any time to swear to the truth of the above declaration." Signed "Dr. Fuernrohr, Attorney-at-law".
Now a last statement on this point; that will be Exhibit 109. It is Document 41. It is on page 63 of Document Book II. It is a declaration of Director Carl Schmid: "Herr Wilhelm List is one of the few of my acquaintances who have not changed their attitude -"
MR. FULKERSON (Interrupting): Object to this affidavit on the ground that it is not made under oath. He says here in the last sentence, "I am willing to make this declaration under oath".
DR. LATERNSER: I am afraid the translation is incorrect. The translation must be incorrect, because the German original reads that "I certify this as a sworn statement". This is a sworn statement.
THE PRESIDENT: It might be referred to the translators for translation.
INTERPRETER WEBER: It says, "I have pleasure in stating that on oath". That would be the correct translation.
THE PRESIDENT: Do you waive any further objection?
MR. FULKERSON: Yes, Your Honor.
THE PRESIDENT: Very well.
DR. LATERNSER: "Director Carl Schid, Declaration. Herr Wilhelm List is one of the few of my acquaintances who have not changed their attitude towards me and my family right to the end. I am emphasizing this point particularly as I am married to a Jewish woman and because most of my acquaintances did not, or did not want to, know me any more after the Party came into power.
"I have known Herr List since 1898 and I know too his honorable and straightforward character which he has proved by his attitude towards me and my wife even during the worst years from 1933 right up to the end. I have pleasure in stating this on oath." Signed Karl Schmid.
THE PRESIDENT: Pardon me, just a minute. Purely a technical remark, but I believe you referred to the exhibit as Document 141, and the document that I have before me seems to be 41. Which is correct?
DR. LATERNSER: 41 is correct, and the exhibit number is 109. I have now brought to conclusion my presentation of evidence regarding Count IV of the Indictment. I shall now proceed with the last part of my evidence. The documents which I now wish to read are designed to give you a very comprehensive picture of the character of Field Marshal List. In this connection it is the theory of the defense that a character having the qualities of Field Marshal List only orders measures of military necessity. That is the theory of the defense. I beg to submit as the first document List No. 1, to be Exhibit 110. It is an affidavit of -
MR. FULKERSON (Interrupting): I would like to object to this document on an entirely different ground. The perusal of it will show you that it is intended merely as an analysis of the defendant List's character, with his various virtues and so forth, and is a general dissertation on what a fine man he is. Now the rule, as I understand it, regarding character of testimony is that the witness can only testify that his reputation is good or bad. He is not supposed to go into a detailed analysis of various incidents or particular virtues which the defendant may possess, as this affidavit and various others do, and I would like to object to it for that reason.
DR. LATERNSER: May it please the Tribunal, in my view it is one of the most salient points to prove what kind of a man List was.
THE PRESIDENT: What is the document? You have not identified the Page number.
DR. LATERNSER: It is page 64 of Document Book II. It is one of the most vital evidence of the whole case and it is the task of the defense to present the qualities of character of the defendant.
THE PRESIDENT: Dr. Laternser, pardon me. Under our American procedure and the rules that would guide us in our American courts, an affidavit of this character or testimony of this character would not be admissible. However, not being familiar with the procedure in Germany or as to whether or not such testimony would be admissible in a German court, it is the judgment and ruling of the Tribunal that they would rather err, if it is an error, in favor of the defendants, and for that reason the objection will be overruled.
DR. LATERNSER: It is an affidavit by Generaloberst retired Wilhelm Adam. The second paragraph: "My last military post has been that of Commander in Chief of Army Group 2, from 1 April 1938 until the middle of October 1938, when I went into retirement. During the war I have not held any military or other position.
"Herr Dr. Laternser has requested me to make a declaration about Field Marshal List. It gives me great satisfaction to comply with this request, because List, whose sad fate touches me most deeply, is my oldest and best friend. I have known him for almost 50 years. Together we spent our time as young lieutenants in the Bavarian Engineers' Corps, together we were officers in the General Staff, and later our high military posts brought us together frequently. I believe therefore that I am able to give a good picture of this man." I shall omit the next paragraph. "He is one of the most clean-minded and self-denying men I have ever known. I do not believe that this man, whom I really would like to describe as an anima candida has ever done an injustice to anybody in all his life.
"Humanity, benevolence and kindness were more to his heart than severity, and whenever he was forced to exercise this he himself suffered most under it."
I shall omit the next paragraph that is on page 65, and proceed:
"His superior officers esteemed him for his talents, his assiduity, his clean character and for his outstanding probity.
"List has reached the peak of his career in our profession not through anybody's favor, not even in the last stages, but through his predominant mental and characteristic properties."
I shall omit the next paragraph and proceed:
"When Hitler came into power, List was doubtlessly opposed to him and to his regime, the same as most of the other generals. Intrinsically he has doubtlessly remained in this attitude to the last. And I know from my own experience of the conflicts arising in his soul from the discord of his intrinsic opposition and his soldierly sense of duty. He suffered Hitler like something imposed upon us by fate."
I shall now omit the next paragraph. "His retirement - at the end of 1942 - must certainly have alleviated his feelings. From his quiet nook in Garmisch he watched the development of events with fear and apprehension."
The next document I beg to submit is an affidavit of General von Kress, that is List Document 109, to be Exhibit 111. It is on page 78 of Document Book II. I shall omit the first paragraph and proceed with the first sentence of the second paragraph. "I have known Field Marshal List for many years." I shall now omit the remainder and proceed with the third paragraph: "I have come to know List as a straightforward and upright man; he is known as such in the whole army. He never made a secret of his opinions and regardless of the opinion of others he proceeded on the path which he considered the right one. This alone reveals the fact --".
MR. FULKERSON: I object to this document because as far as I am able to tell it is not made either under oath or declared to be a statement that is true in lieu of oath, as the others have been.
DR. LATERNSER: The statement is authenticated by the Notary 10 in Munich, and it contains an affidavit of Notary Office 10 in Munich.
MR. FULKERSON: It is proven that the signature is authentic, but there is still nothing here to indicate that this was made under oath or that this man considered himself to be bound.
DR. LATERNSER: If counsel for the prosecution had only read the first sentence he would have known that it is an affidavit.
THE PRESIDENT: The first sentence indicates that the affiant was conscious of the significance of this statement, and under the circumstances the exhibit will be admitted.
DR. LATERNSER: I shall read from the third paragraph:
"I have come to know List as a straightforward and upright man; he is known as such in the whole army. He never made a secret of his opinions and regardless of the opinion of others he proceeded on the path which he considered the right one. This alone reveals the fact that on no occasion did he try to ingratiate himself with the ruling National Socialists. He absolutely repudiated the monstrosities of National Socialism and advocated at any time the old and tried German officers' standpoint which became clearly apparent in all his character.
As I personally had been removed by Hitler from the Army on 4 February 1938 because of my negative attitude towards National Socialism, my judgment in this connection would seem to carry special weight. As Commander of a Division I found in my Commanding General List a man with whom I could freely and frankly talk about my views with regard to the Hitler system and whose opinions were absolutely identical with mine. After the 4th of February 1938 he certainly did not stay in his profession in order to win, by the grace of Hitler, honors and decorations, but merely out of his passion for his calling and in order to serve the good cause even under conditions rendered so much more difficult. The elevations in rank and title he did not aspire to, but he rather accepted them, for, the wider his sphere of activity and his influence in military matters became, the more was he enabled to serve the good cause. List was by no means a product of Hitler's protection, he owes his rise exclusively to his military efficiency and reliable personality, which is likely to have impressed Hitler too." I shall now omit the first part of the next paragraph and proceed from the last quarter of the page: "Just put yourself seriously and unprejudiced in the situation of these officers. They are not criminals, but, on the contrary, tried to combat the crimes which were systematically being brought into their realm by the National Socialist regime. Under such circumstances they cannot in justice be held responsible for all occurrences in their sphere of command." According to my observations, List has a deep-rooted religious disposition." I shall omit the next two sentences. "List put no obstacles in the way of the Wehrmacht chaplains, as it was desired higher up; on the contrary, he supported them with all his power.
"In connection with the question of religion I come to List's attitude towards the Jews. He, of course, like any decent and reasonable human being, deeply abominated the persecution of Jews. Except for the National Socialist leaders, at that time no one in Germany thought of a persecution of Jews at all; the activities of a man like Streicher were everywhere considered with contempt.
I thus cannot imagine that, when during the war the persecution of the Jews was ordered, List had anything to do with it."
I shall omit the last paragraph. Signed, "Freiherr v. Kress."
The next document offered is List Document 23, to be Exhibit 112 on page 67 of Document Book II. It is an affidavit of General, retired, Franz Halder. I shall read from the third paragraph.
"I have always known the former Field Marshal List to be a typical representative of the Bavarian officer of the old school, animated by the ideals of his calling and deeply rooted in the principles of an honorable and conscientious German soldier." I shall omit the next sentence and proceed with the ultimate sentence. "Even in front of Hitler without regard to his own person I saw him maintain his opinion as, for instance, in the question of methods of fighting in the Caucasus. This resulted in his being recalled. Next page:
"Seen from political angles, I have known List to be the typically non-political soldier of Seekt's school. Even before the 'coming into power', he was rather critically disposed towards Hitler and his party and, during his activity of Commander of the Dresden Infantry School, he energetically counteracted the sympathies for the movement which were perceptible in the circles of the cadets. His rejecting attitude, in my opinion, was not directed against the program of the party but against the spirit represented and fostered by Hitler and his party, this spirit being alien to the honorable and old profession of soldiers.
"I have never heard Field Marshal List making any remarks against the Jews, but, on the contrary, he expressed the most severe condemnation of the fighting methods of the party in combatting the Jews.
"As regards bis religious attitude, I know that List is a confirmed Christian."
I shall omit the next paragraph. "In his troops Field Marshal List kept an iron discipline and, as far as I was able to observe, the great respect he enjoyed in the ranks helped him to attain his aims everywhere. All non-military influences which intruded upon the compass of his military responsibility he combatted with all the means at his disposal." I shall omit the last paragraph. Signed, "Franz Halder".
My attention has just been drawn to the fact that in reading the first paragraph on page 68 I made an error. It is the first sentence of page 2, on page 68; "Seen from political angles, I have known List to be the typically non-political soldier of Seekt's school."
The next document I beg to read is List 134, to be Exhibit 113. It is on page 70 of Volume 2, Document Book II. It is an affidavit of General Konrad. I shall read from the third paragraph:
"I am only obeying the dictates of my conscience if I declare that Field Marshal List, for the officers and soldiers of the former German Army, was one of those personages of our corps of military leaders who are most worthy of reverence and this primarily for the reason of his humane attitude."
I shall omit the next sentence and the next paragraph and proceed with the ultimate paragraph of the page:
"In the Polish campaign, for instance, he has a high officer meet and conduct in a sympathetic and gentle manner the Polish Commander whose army he defeated and whom he took prisoner.
"When he learns during the Polish campaign that agents of Himmler's are working in the area of his command and that they are treating the Polish and Jewish population with arbitrariness and duress, he at once interferes with severe orders and exhorts the army corps under his command to have a sharp eye on their communication zones. He has the agents of Himmler's brought before a court martial and with the whole weight of his personality he tenaciously insists on their criminal prosecution."
From the next paragraph I only wish to read the last sentence:
"The discipline of the Army of the Field Marshal as regards the inhabitants of the country stands on the highest level and is continually superintended by him.
"In the same manner as in the Polish campaign I saw the Field Marshal in the French war. No Frenchman ever raised a word of complaint against this noble, chivalrous and kind man; even the French Government did not protest against the conduct of his army. I know that, by his benevolent behavior, he gave human happiness in the dreariness of war to quite a number of Frenchmen who were in distress."
I shall omit the remainder of this page and wish to read from page 72 from the second paragraph:
"He did not bow to the military demands of Adolf Hitler. Just as he shielded the Polish and Jewish population in the Polish campaign, so he shielded here in Russia the life of his own men with unequalled responsibility. Hitler demanded from the Field Marshal an attack operation which could never result in reaching the desired goal and which foolhardily jeopardized valuable units of the army.
"The Field Marshal refused to carry out the operation. He took upon himself all responsibility and stood protectively before his subcommanders. He was dismissed and had to suffer the bitter lot of not being able to help his nation in its most difficult time."
I shall now read the last sentence of this affidavit;
"But if this man was compelled to issue harsh orders and to take severe steps, contrary to his wishes and disposition, then there are also coercing pre-suppositions due to the conduct of the war by the Balkan opponents."
The next document I wish to offer is Document List 162 to be Exhibit 114. It's on page 65 of Document Book 3. It's an affidavit of the former ambassador Von Papen. It's not #162 but, correction, 162A to be Exhibit 114. I shall read from the third paragraph:
"1. In the summer of 1937 General Field Marshal List as the leader of a German military commission to Vienna for the Prinz Eugen memorial festivities; was my guest at the German consulate in Vienna.
"On this occasion we had a personal conversation about the disquieting aspects of the Hitler regime. General Field Marshal List on this occasion clearly expressed his negative stand with respect to all political steps which could lead to war, as well as methods of the NSDAP which were to serve the purpose of uniting Austria with the Reich through force.
"2. When after the occupation of Greece in 1941, the Apostolic Delegate for Turkey, Msgr. Roncalli asked me to support his trip to Athens as ordered by the Pope as well as his negotiations, I forwarded his request to General Field Marshal List with my recommendation.
"Msgr. Roncalli, now apostolic Nuntius in Paris, expressed his gratitude to me after his return from Greece because General Field Marshal List had facilitated his mission in every possible way. The Field Marshal had shown complete understanding for the religious questions and had assured him of all support."
The next document I wish to submit......
The next document will be Exhibit 115. It's Document 161. It's on page 121 of Document Book 2. It's an affidavit of Count Abensperg. I shall read from the fifth paragraph, the last paragraph, of page 121.
"I have known Field Marshal List since 1943 and have met him and spoken to him several times at social meetings and hunts; he was even once my guest at such an occasion.
"At these meetings I have never talked to him about politics, as I knew already at that time that the Field Marshal, on account of his political disagreements with Hitler, practically no longer played a role.
At that time it was here a generally known fact that he was an absolute opponent of the Nazi ideology and that the Field Marshal had the reputation of being of impeccable character, of being an officer of the old school and an honorable gentleman from top to bottom. I remember, however, that he, on the occasion of our meeting, once or twice made disapproving remarks about the methods of the NSDAP, especially about their shameful methods concerning religious matters and the Jewish question; but as I do not remember details I am not able to repeat these statements literally. I know, however, and this can be affirmed by many persons of this place that there was constant talk about his having been already relieved from his post as military commander at that time, because he rejected tho manner of warfare propagated by the NSDAP and the Military Governments in the Occupied Territories and because he was one of these generals who were disliked by Hitler for their uprightness and because they were no willing tools."
The next affidavit I wish to offer is Document List 164, contained in Document Book 3 on page 67 and it's to be Exhibit 116, an affidavit by Hans Schweiger. The number has been altered to 164A. It's on page 67 of Document Book 3. I shall read from the third paragraph:
"I was not a member of the NSDAP or of its organization nor a candidate for membership and as soloist at the Vienna State Opera I was deferred from military service."
I shall read from the last paragraph:
"As soon as he entered his service in Vienna, Field Marshal List and his family and we became very close not because of our blood relationship but because of genuine friendship which resulted from the same spiritual and cultural interests, from the really 'Austrian' attitude towards life displayed by him and his family and last, but not least, through our identical political attitude.
"With regard to the latter, I well remember a wonderful remark by Frau List, which she made to my wife and me in the first days of her Vienna stay: 'We were so afraid that you might be Nazis.'" I shall omit the next paragraph and shall read the last paragraph.
From the middle paragraph I should like to read the second part:
"And that is how I know, that he hated National Socialism because of its inner and outer falsity, that the suppression of other persons of other opinions and the inhumanity of the persecution of Jews aroused him to anger and that he was only able to look at the German and European future with a heavy heart."
Now I turn to the last paragraph:
"His interest in music and especially his love for Mozart were extraordinary. I do not believe that there was one performance of a Mozart opera at the State Opera which he did not attend. The members of the Vienna Philharmonic expressed their gratitude for his enthusiasm for the Vienna Philharmonic and his really friendly relationship with them, by presenting him with the 'Philharmonic ring' which is only given in very rare instances."
I shall omit the remainder of the page and shall just read the last sentence:
"He feared and despised nothing more than war and during the days of Godesberg, when he and his family were with us on the Attersee, he spent sleepless nights.
"In his letters to me there are sentences which in their simplicity testify to a knowledge of the true values of our being and which are documents of highest philosophic spiritual attitude."
The next document I wish to submit will consist of affidavits originating from his co-workers. It will be List 25 to be Exhibit 117. It's to be found in Document Book 2 on page 94. It's an affidavit by major, subsequently colonel, Hepp of which I wish to read from the third paragraph: